No Big LoCo Surprise – Arrogant, Scheming LCPS Wins, Citizens Lose

By Loudoun Insider

I am too disgusted to even write much about the Leesburg school boundary cases right now. Even though I thought this would be the outcome, I am still infuriated. Strike up another GOBGN win.


  • BlackOut says:

    LO, no obsession, not sure why you keep thinking that.

    Judge heard both sides. Judge ruled. End of case.

    As I said, happens every day in the courts across America. Half feel vindicated and half feel pissed off. Not anyway to get around that.

    So, if you feel strong enough then rally and file an appeal.

    For what it is worth kids have been moved around this county ever since I got here 25 years ago. It ain’t gonna change. Kids get moved and parents get pissed off. Some parents are happy. (frankly the kids don’t give a shit) That’s just the name of the game around here.

  • Wolverine says:

    BO — You get the prize for telling it the way it is and always has been around here on the issue of school boundaries. I’ll see your 25 years and add another eight to it. It’s the Loudoun argument that never ends.

  • Loudoun Moron says:

    Can’t wait til they start working on boundaries for the new Ashburn elem schools that will open next year. Dear God.

  • Loudoun Moron says:

    So, maybe I am WAY out of left field here, but there’s no chance Whitbeck (Hi John!) as the lawyer for the a plaintiff in this case was in cahoots with the GOBGN?

  • Loudoun Insider says:

    BO, the big problem in this instance is the blatant political machinations and considerations and ridiculous favoritism that was shown. This probably occurred in many other boundary disputes as well, but wasn’t as exposed as it was in this case with the emails produced by FOIA and legal discovery.

    Who knows where Whitbeck was on this – his buddy and 10th District Republican Committee Comnunications Director was right in the middle of this mess with Bergel, and Whitbeck’s legal aide worked with that guy for years. A little too cozy in my opinion.

  • Sic Semper Tyrannis says:

    Failed Campaign Promise

    When Ms. Bergel was running for reelection last fall, one of her visions was, and I quote from her website, “that the overcrowding in Leesburg’s elementary schools will finally be addressed with the opening of Douglass next fall. As I have stated for the last two years, all must be ready for this discussion. Several concerns were left on the table with the last boundary change before I was on the school Board. I look forward to making decisions for the betterment of all Leesburg elementary school students.”

  • Sic Semper Tyrannis says:

    Chairman John Stevens, December 13, 2011

    School Board Meeting

    “The proposal to divide CL19 is not made on its own merits for the people who live in CL19. It is made because in enables other neighborhoods, not CL19, to get the school placements that they want to have. And the fact that so few people from CL19 and nobody from my knowledge from Evans Ridge wrote to us or came to speak or arranged a meeting, means that we’re making this decision for the benefit of other people while those people are out of the room. And that just doesn’t sit right with me.”

  • Sic Semper Tyrannis says:

    Why did Mrs. Bergel split CL19? Was it to keep Spring Lakes community at Tolbert at all cost? Mrs. Bergel said she was unavailable to meet with her constituents during the entire rezoning process (October – December) but her phone records reveal that she talk to David D’Onofrio (Spring Lakes) and FIOA emails reveal others from Spring Lakes thanking Mrs. Bergel for meeting with the Spring Lakes community.

    Date: Thu, 12/15/2011 12:29:40 PM
    Subject: New School Zoning

    I talked with Sam today and he said I should email with any questions regarding the new zoning for Frederick Douglas. I have two concerns regarding this zoning. My first concern is that all communities were left together except for CL19 which is Potomac Station. It is my understanding that 52 children are in CL 19 and that would put Tolbert over capacity. I understand it was not possible to just move these children, but what I don’t understand is why Spring Lakes was not zoned for Frederick Douglas. Looking at the Demographic in these two areas, it seems the community of Spring Lakes would have balanced Frederick Douglas better than CL19. Spring Lakes is right next to CL 15.1 which is zoned for Frederick Douglas.

    My second concern is that those children zoned for Frederick Douglas are coming from lower income homes. The demographic going to Frederick Douglas and Francis Hazel Reid or Tolbert seem to look entirely different. I would like to know the percentage of students going to Frederick Douglas who have free or reduced lunch and those children in the ESL program. I am also curious if this information is based on home owners or those renting that will actually be attending the school.

    I know the other parents in the area are asking the same questions. They want to know why all communities were kept together except for the 52 students of Potomac Station and why Spring Lakes would not be zoned for Frederick Douglas.
    Thanks you for your time,


  • Loudoun One says:

    Time for a change in administration. No one is “pissed off” because their children were sent to another elementary school. It is the collusion of the leadership of LCPS with JB and River Creekers to get their way. Ignore by-laws and throw some other railroad blocks up to make sure of the end game.

    Concerned citizens from all over Leesburg all helped in getting the evidence together through the Freedom of Information Act. So the aggrieved in this case extended beyond the petitioners.

    JB called all the shots. She told Sam exactly where she wanted folks to go. And that became the “independent” staff plan.

    Tom Marshall, so sorry you were just outmanuevered on this. You will see how Sam asks JB where she wants the 7 clusters to go in the STAFF plan. Guess where she tells them? Catoctin!

    JB: We got your number. Literally and figuratively. Ahhh.. Same goes for DD as well.

  • HOAhell says:

    River Creek resident proposes splitting CL 19 to RC can stay at Frances Hazel Reid.

  • Sic Semper Tyrannis says:

    I love this email posted by TRUTH…..

    In an email exchange dated 10/31/11 from David D’Onofrio (needs no introduction here) to LCSB member Jennifer Bergel with his wife Steph CC’d

    “Jen, I have reworked my election day schedule and am happy to take on the evening till close for the D’Onofrio’s.”

    Jen in response
    “Ok. Thanks! Could you clarify the timeframe for me then? So appreciate it! Steph, I will bring signs by tomorrow. Still pulling some new ones and putting old ones in their place. Hope to bring you five.”

    Fast forward to 12/13/11
    David D’Onofrio signs a letter of support for Bergel Plan 2 (designed by River Creek)…which was ultimately adopted.

    Perhaps it is a coincidence but I am doubtful that it is.

  • Loudoun Watch says:

    From: Jennifer Bergel
    To: Sam Adamo
    CC: John Stevens
    Date: Tue, 12/6/2011 8:05:56 AM
    Subject: Please change the CL 19 numbers

    Hi Dr Adamo

    The numbers on the Bergel Plan 2 for CL19’s division are not consistent with the River Creek numbers for CL19. Could you please revise it today and then send it to the board for review. It is imperative that consistency is maintained with the intent of the plan. Escpecially with the release of SPED info.

    Thank you so much. Looking forward to the change. I have copied Stew Curley and David D’Onofrio on this exchange because they have expressed an interest in seeing the revision.

    Thanks again,

    Jennifer K. Bergel
    LCPS School Board
    Catoctin District

    Please be aware that correspondence sent by to to School Board Members is subject to Virginia’s Freedom of Information Act.


  • HOAhell says:

    The judge apparently ignored the evidence and relied on a reflexive GOBGN response to a challenge from outside interlopers: no matter what is alleged, upuhold the institution. That could be public schools, the HR director at Loudoun County, or the Board of Equalization.
    This judge should be aware that two of his BOE appointees made a mockery of his court when they lied in the last FOIA trial. If he is aware and has not removed those two people, he is unethical. If he is not aware, he is not discharging his judicial duty. In either case, the judge’s recent actions contradict his storied reputation for fairness. His favoritism to the rude and irreverent LCPS attorney was blatant throughout the Douglass boundary trial. BO and others who blindly defend his reputation need to read through a couple of transcripts, and maybe even go sit in his courtroom sometime. He needs to retire.

  • JusticeLeague says:

    Thanks for posting the FOIA’d docs Loudoun HOA. I just read them on your site.

    Now, the puzzle pieces are falling into place! No wonder EVERY plan that came out of LCPS (referred to as the “Staff Plan”), placed one community above all others. It appears that “Sam the Man” was BFFs with the RC’rs.

    Many people wondered throughout the process why all the Staff plans put River Creek first and made the rest fit. Having that as the starting place for plans, disregarded §2-32 from the get-go.

    It was also very strange that the Staff kept pumping out multiple plans-usually Staff puts out one plan and adjustments are made from that plan. Not this time, as it looks like Staff saw fit to triple-guard, and have the Bergel Plan 2 as added protection.

    Too bad all this info wasn’t disseminated to the public along with the info about the cash proffers. That would have saved parents a lot of time and energy in this process.

    From what I now understand, Ms. Bergel was the Chair of the Finance and Facilities at the time Sam requested the cash. Is this info accurate?

    I can only hope that Ashburn is tuning in now, and demanding the removal of some of these players BEFORE their boundary process begins.

    Oh, and BO, I hear ya, the case has ended, but you seem savvy enough to know that a judge ONLY reviews what has been admitted into evidence.

    I imagine all those thousands of relevant documents didn’t make it across his desk. However, the bottom line is that this goes FAR beyond the judge and his decision. It rests with the rights of the citizens who deserve transparency in their government.

  • Loudoun Watch says:

    From: Meaghan (RC Resident and former LCPS staffer)
    To: Sam Adamo
    Date: Tue. 11/29/2011 6:47:42 PM


    I was calling earlier simply to thank you for submitting your Staff Amended Plan.
    This is a very solid plan and I like it very much for many reasons.
    I also really appreciate you taking the time to correct the feed situation with moving 7 to Catoctin and moving 17.1 to FHR.
    You are a smart and fair man Sam and I think you are doing the right thing.

    I want you to know that I really appreciate all your hard work.

    Please don’t share this email with anyone. I don’t want to deal with any politics.


    (Company Information Redacted)

  • HOAhell says:


    Sam the Man!
    Your favorite attorney,

  • BlackOut says:

    Emotions on school boundaries have been electrified forever!

    I participated in my fair share of boundary battles back in the day, and frankly don’t have the energy for them anymore. Plus my kids are out of the game anyway. So those here who still are up for the fight please carry on. Parent activism does make a difference.

    With that said, a couple of things I’ve learned with these things. First, as complex as boundaries are, they really boil down to two approaches. One is boundaries based on proximity to schools, and the second is boundaries drawn while maintaining community continuity. The debate on these two approaches has raged for years. In the end, I think the right approach was adopted that being keep communities together.

    Toss into both of these a dose of federal rules and you got pretty much everything.

    We are adding schools every year. Every year new boundaries need to be adopted. The proximity approach will never work with this dynamic. It moves more kids more often and also breaks up what is most important to the kids, which is staying with their friend.

    The best approach for the kids is to go with the community continuity approach. Keep the neighborhoods together and move them around from elementary to middle to H.S. Kids stay happy, parents stay together and boundary adjustments are easier to make.

    My kids have been through multiple moves and schools. A norm for most residents with school age kids in Loudoun. At the end of the day, all the schools are good. Kids get a great education and frankly they don’t get as exercised about the boundary moves as parents. I remember asking my daughter once about her opinion on Harper Park Middle School for something. She didn’t even remember going there. Ask her who was in her 7th grade class and she will remember.

    Lastly, I’ve always felt the school staff did an excellent job navigating through the emotional issue of boundaries. Never saw the issues being complained about in this case.

  • JusticeLeague says:

    BO-Community continuity approach?

    The adopted plan created 3 (!) split feeds-some were new split feeds to boot. That did not have to happen.

    The Bergel Plan 2 shattered many community feeds. Not emotional, just the facts.

    It will be interesting to see if, during the next Leesburg boundary process, the community who broke all these feeds with the adopted plan, suddenly asserts community continuity as their top priority next time around.

    Like you BO, my child is not affected by this decision. I have been a resident of Loudoun County (almost as many years as you). I too, have been an advocate for our public schools.

    Glad to hear you’ve not experienced any of these issues. However, in this case, I believe it is fair to question what transpired, and to ensure that special interests do not play a role in decisions made on the behalf of Loudoun’s children.

  • HOAhell says:

    The truth is that the Beacon Hill and Potomac Station parents are way too polite. What happened to them is outrageous, based on either proximity, community, or both.

    Good for John Whitbeck and Michael Petkovich for challenging it. BlackOut, your info just might possibly be a wee bit dated, but your heart is in the right place.

  • Loudoun Watch says:

    @Black Out
    No one has ever dug deep into any boundary decision until now.
    If any community took the effort, perhaps they would have took their “complaints” to the School Board or to the courts.

    I feel that you are trivializing what BH was trying to expose. The court case was quite limited as to what could be admitted into evidence.
    The larger record of documents produced by the FOIAs is the most complete record.
    As far as the LCPS administrative court record is concerned, it is mainly fluffery. Judkins would never produce documents damaging the image of Hatrick and staff.

  • Sic Semper Tyrannis says:


    “The greatest concern I have primarily breaking communities up but that is not a question for you.” Mr. Reed, November 14, 2011, School Board Meeting.

    The plan adopted failed in COMMUNITY.

    Divided Communities/Split Feeders

    We now have divided neighborhoods (such as Potomac Station) and split feeds from Elementary to Middle to High school; where again none of these were necessary other than to “make the numbers work” for the adopted plan.

    Equally disturbing as these failures are (see the LCPS email that shows staff is “inclined to reduce other Planning Zones by a couple kids MORE each and plug them into the CL20 & CL20.1 zones instead”). How can staff move children between planning zones when they are supposed to be based on their actual residence?

    Needless Bussing Across Town/Walkable Communities Now Bussed

    There are students who are bused to a school several miles away instead of walking to their current school – this is occurring while other neighborhoods who are practically in the Ashburn district being bused clear across Leesburg to attend one of the most western Leesburg schools. We have now witnessed the old board forsake the idea of community for numbers on a slide and unnecessarily long bus rides.

  • heart broken says:

    Maybe just maybe an appeal is in the works to the va supreme court? Maybe ALL of the email records will be allowed into evidence since very few made it to judge horned desk. I guarantee that if a jury heard this case they would without a doubt sided with the plaintiffs.

  • Sic Semper Tyrannis says:

    Chairman Stevens “Priority” Email

    An email, dated December 12, 2011, from Chairman Stevens to Ms. Bergel, with the subject “my priorities”, Chairman Stevens lists his priorities as follows:

    1. Create FRM/ELL balance. Most plans do this fairly well so I don’t see a problem here. (This is not a correct statement and they FAILED in creating FRM/ELL balance – the new school will open with a higher FRM and ELL balance then we have had prior to the start of this process and some schools within Leesburg will have a very low percentage of FRM/ELL below 6%)

    2. Prevent regional K-5 sped programs from being concentrated in a few schools and missing in others. I view this as a demographic balance issue as well as an instructional issue. (FAILED)

    3. Maintain CL19 as a single unit. (FAILED)

    4. Prevent split feed to MS smaller than 35% (FAILED)

    5. Keep Catoctin under 600 enrollment (FAILED)

    6. Maintain contiguous areas 15.2, 15.1 (Lakes at Red Rock)

    All but one of Chairman Stevens priorities failed in the plan that was adopted.

  • HOAhell says:

    For those unable to suspend disbelief, perhaps a graphic would help depict the proximity of River Creek to Frances Hazel Reid.
    This looks like a 1963 segregation map from Birmingham Alabama.

  • HOAhell says:

    One more troubling aspect of this case is the jaundiced approach of Loudoun’s press corps. The same person whose cell number shows up frequently in Bergel’s phone logs has carte blanche with the Loudoun Time Mirror’s “board” and helps out with story selection there.
    Leesburg Today’s editor enjoyed a two-hour lunch at Clyde’s/Willow Creek, next to the LCPS admin building, with LCPS PIO Wade Byard a couple of weeks before this trial. Researching an editorial, no doubt.
    Their coverage is archived under the “School Boundary” tab at

  • Hi Mom says:

    Here’s a dissenting opinion the judge couldn’t write –Rivercreek has $500K in proffers that Sam the Man wants for a new school. Sam the Man meets with Rivercreek and gives them everything they need to write a plan, which they submit directly to Sam the Man. It then becomes the staff plan (for all others to use as a starting point) and with a couple Rivercreek tweaks it becomes THE PLAN.

    Rivercreek leverages the political power it can muster to ensure re-election of their School board representative and seals the deal that THE PLAN has legs with the board.

    Further senior administers in LCPS who live or own property in Rivercreek (they have to live someplace and we know they are paid plenty so why not Rivercreek.) All go along with THE PLAN and pat Sam the Man on the back for a job well done.

    Nothing arbitrary – Rivercreek bought the right to pick their school, bought their representative, and the administration made good on their deal.

    Further review: LCPS by-laws are not worth the paper they are written on. The rules that LCPS must follow are the State Laws. LCPS didn’t break any (state) laws nor act arbitrarily – simply put, they write the rules and can choose if they follow them. They did what they planned to do from day 1. Nothing we can do about that…

    So what’s the problem – isn’t this the way it works? Why shouldn’t the LCPS administration talk directly to the people to get their views? Why can’t they take the citizens plans and make them their own (its free! and gives them more time to go to lunch with their cronies). Why not let the School board limit the talk time at it’s meetings so we can all get home to kiss our children goodnight? After all you can email them all day long, maybe even to their personal email accounts! What’s wrong with plans directly to the administration when the School Board specifically says they have to go through a SB Representative? What does it matter if the School Board representatives can’t make the meetings, there is a minimum quorum? Isn’t the minimum good enough? If not, why is it the minimum? Come with me people, LCPS is going above and beyond for you…

    The problem is the process run by LCPS is a complete farce perpetrated on the parents that participated. These parents spent many hours following the process and thought they would be able to influence the outcome or even put together something that benefits the children in central Loudoun. Sorry folks – the groundwork was laid way before the School Board started the boundary hearings. Too bad nobody has the chutzpah to tell everyone up front and save everyone the colossal waste of time.

  • BlackOut says:

    Ya got that proximity thing HOAh. Like I said folks playing that card against the public process is older than dirt. Doesn’t really make a difference. It’s one approach but not always the right approach. It certainly didn’t win the day in this case.

    And come on! Byard is the public information officer. I am glad he’s meeting with the press. I know you seem to think this case is on the forefront of everyone’s mind, but chances are it didn’t even come up. School starts next week, lots and lots of public information needs to be shared with the media.

    Good luck on the appeal. On what legal basis will you be moving forward on? Procedural errors?

    …and frankly as a taxpayer I am going to get really pissed if you draw this out and waste more taxpayer cash on defending this action. You lost!! You’re beginning to remind me of the OptOut crowd.

  • JusticeLeague says:

    BO-something is starting to stink!

    Let’s go back to what you are advocating: community continuity. I’ll guess this bears repeating:

    BO-Community continuity approach?

    The adopted plan created 3 (!) split feeds-some were new split feeds to boot. That did not have to happen.

    The Bergel Plan 2 shattered many community feeds. Not emotional, just the facts.

    It will be interesting to see if, during the next Leesburg boundary process, the community who broke all these feeds with the adopted plan, suddenly asserts community continuity as their top priority next time around.

    Like you BO, my child is not affected by this decision. I have been a resident of Loudoun County (almost as many years as you). I too, have been an advocate for our public schools.

    Glad to hear you’ve not experienced any of these issues. However, in this case, I believe it is fair to question what transpired, and to ensure that special interests do not play a role in decisions made on the behalf of Loudoun’s children.
    And I’ll add that there has been nothing noted in the press that there will be an appeal, so what’s your source? Or, perhaps you are throwing this up :0 for other reasons?

    Also, as a taxpayer and someone who appears to be “in the know,” you should be aware that the Petitioners are tax payers as well. I realize some of the attorney work was Pro Bono, but the sad irony is the Petitioners helped to pay for the defense of LCPS through their own tax dollars.

    If you are “pissed off” perhaps you are the one who is getting too emotional about all this.

    Again, the citizens deserve transparency in their government.

  • HOAhell says:

    BO. I have some swampland down in Florida that I would love to offer at a reduced price. Let’s talk!

  • BlackOut says:

    heartbroken mentioned the possibility of an appeal. See above. That’s my source. Plus with all the haranguing going on here it’s really the only recourse, other than just kibitzing.

    Loudoun Watch, you’re kidding right by stating this(?):

    “No one has ever dug deep into any boundary decision until now.
    If any community took the effort, perhaps they would have took their “complaints” to the School Board or to the courts.”

    I’d be comfortable in saying there is no other process in government that isn’t dug in to deeper. It is constant. Many, many communities have taken on the task of influencing the boundary process.

    As for the appeal JL, what would it be based on? You had your day in court, I have little issue with the money already spent by the taxpayers in defending the process, but if this gets dragged on there better be a really really good justification. I’ve not heard of any procedural errors by the court or counsel.

  • JusticeLeague says:

    BO, I haven’t had a a day in court, and I take it either have you? Personally, I mean…

    I guess we will both see (along with the rest of LoCo), what those folks decide to do, and if an appeal is in the works.

    In the meantime, let’s continue the dialogue about ways to improve transparency in our government. Ultimately, that was the heart of this matter.

    It costs nothing for taxpayers to ask questions, gain insight, and demand transparency. So BO, what are you so afraid of? Government run amok? I think that box has already been checked.

  • BlackOut says:

    Rhetorically speaking there JL, this case has had it’s day in court. Sorry I was specific enough.

    I am all for transparency both from government and those trying to influence government.

    I am not afraid of anything JL, (other than fast moving snakes) Just seems to me folks jump to the amok conclusion much too quickly. Especially when they are pissed at a ruling. Transparency as stated will always help that.

  • JusticeLeague says:

    Thanks for the needed clarification BO. Clarity is always appreciated.

    Looks like we have something else in common. I too am afraid of snakes, but only the venomous kind, and the ones you never see coming.

    Just for the record, I’m not angry with the ruling. The ruling is what is, but I suspect if the public were privy to the entire record on this matter, people would be outraged by the lack of transparency from LCPS.

  • LoCoTransparency says:

    @HiMom What happened to the $500K in proffers that River Creek had that Sam the Man wants???

  • BlackOut says:

    It’s ludicrous to think the LCPS is trading or even can barter boundry set-ups for proffers.

    It’s these types of claims that tosses the effort into that of the much mi-lined OptOut organization.

  • LoCoTransparency says:

    @BO I agree it IS ludicrous…suggest you follow the paper trail…

  • Loudoun Insider says:

    BlackOut is BFFs with Robert DuPree, the former School Board Chairman who loved to be the go to guy for developer deals with the School Board. He even got a job working for the Northern Virginia Building Industry Association while on the School Board to help push the big Greenvest rezonings all while working deals with Greenvest for school sites. BlackOut is a big fan of the LCPS GOBGN.

  • HOAhell says:

    Oh, so Damage Control sent him over?

  • BlackOut says:

    That’s your proof! A supposed barter of funds for a boundary? No where does it say that.

    Only a few and most likely the challenged Bob Onheiser would think this is a cash for boundary document. Is he the one that told you what this is? It looks like something he’d be pushing.

    I especially like the highlighting. Who did that? Show me where it says anything about getting a specific boundary for RC?

    It says, it will benefit RC by providing an elementary school site that will EITHER house the elementary school aged residents of RC or provide relief from overcrowding with the school cluster. Ain’t nothing there that says all RC students WILL or CERTAIN students will attend a specific school.

    Only someone who is trying to read something they aren’t would think this is an agreement for a specific barter.

  • BlackOut says:

    LI, childish of you to always try and throw that in to discount me. I am commenting on my own, with my own opinions, and with my own observations. If all you have is an attempt to discredit what I say by saying I happen to know Dupree you ain’t got nothin’. The only conversation I had with Dupree this summer was about the weather, our families and his dogs.

    Would you like me to through in a few “friends” of yours for effect?

  • Hi Mom says:

    BO – you are correct – Doah. I thought they would have put it all in writing too, but nope they must have made some kind of behind the scene quid pro quo. I’d suggest anyone dealing with LCPS count their fingers after they shake hands with LCPS.

    I am not trying a case here, so try and follow me through the obvious from a lay perspective.

    If there were proof every step of the way the case would have been a slam dunk.

    Oh and one more point – No Big LoCo Surprise – Arrogant, Scheming LCPS Wins, Citizens Lose.

  • Loudoun Insider says:

    Settle down, BO, everyone knows you’re a pretty loyal LCPS apologist!

  • HOAhell says:

    Just as everyone knows there is tension between Mr. Dupree and Mr. Ohneiser. That is irrelevant and for now it is clogging up this thread.
    When it goes over 100 posts, you have to click on “older posts” to see what went before. Just in case someone does not share BO’s deep institutional knowledge.

  • Hillsboro says:

    BO wrote:
    > I am all for transparency both from government and those trying to influence government.

    Given this new-found support for transparency, do you now support Sarah Stinger’s quest for documents related to the horrific LCPS land deal at Wheatland and the mysterious well WLS-16?

    BlackOut’s relentless defense of LCPS status quo was in its’ prime here:

  • Loudoun Insider says:

    BO indeed was all over Stinger for her FOIAs even though her FOIAs unearthed significant bullshit with regard to the spending of our tax dollars. Just like the FOIAs and legal discovery in this case put sunlight on more bullshit perpetrated by our “leaders”. If these FOIAs turned up nothing but ethical upstanding behavior than he would have a point about FOIAs being a nuisance to the wonderful civil servants and elected officials who have to deal with the pesky citizenry.

  • BlackOut says:

    Yup, I definitely had issues with Stinger’s FOIA crap. I wasn’t the only one. Many similarities to the failed attempt here.

    Unfortunately, the Stinger stuff never lead to a decisive decision like we see with the Judge Horne ruling. Guess she lost confidence to take it to the house.

    Same crap, isolated comments of the data collected in the FOIA. No contextual analysis, just sound bite clips trying to pigeon hole in a view point. Over heated emotions with no rational judgment given to the data provided.

    Yup, those who want to see condemning bullshit somehow twist around what is provided just so they can say, “I told ya so”. Well reality is there ain’t no I told ya so.

    Look you can’t just look at a dozen or so emails through a soda straw and make conclusive observations. Stinger’s dust up proved that.

  • BlackOut says:

    Hillsboro, thanks for bring up the history of crap. This is as true as the day I wrote it:

    “…they both grab onto an idea, an idea that has a few grains of truth in them and they are off to the races. Eventually a massive story develops and eventually they are way in over their heads and they start making things up to justify their preconceived notions. As more truth is tossed on the pile they refuse to consider it or adjust their original conclusions. It becomes a big game. They are only looking, hearing or reading things that they want to hear. Once this goes on for sometime then things get real personal with them and they go into defensive mode. It’s a pattern over and over.”

    Nailed it!!

  • Hillsboro says:

    You are correct, sir… your response nails it! I suspect far more than you realize.

Leave Comment