As the court case between HCA and INOVA approaches, the Good Old Boy Network (GOBN) is getting hysterical. It may seem a little far fetched to believe that a local hospital is so tied into the local GOBN, but trust me it is an integral cog in the local machine. If you recall, INOVA was right at the heart of the Dulles South and Ridgewater Park rezoning controversies (as was George Mason University by the way). INOVA sees ongoing rapid growth as a pathway to ongoing rapid growth in revenues and profits, taxpayers be damned, and the hell if they’re going to share any of it with evil HCA.
I know HCA has its share of corporate problems, but INOVA is no saint either. I can tell you one thing, from my perspective any non-profit that has Larry Beerman and John Ryan (puppet master father of Jack) on its board can’t be too squeaky clean. Apparently INOVA is no longer using lawyer Doug Fleming for its local lobbying efforts, now that his long-time friend Bruce Tulloch is no longer on the board of supervisors. I’ve now heard that INOVA’s efforts have gone bipartisan, with Mark Herring at the helm, who apparently has done legal work for them as well.
The simple fact that the past BOS approved 86 out of 87 Special Exceptions filed, with HCA mysteriously being the only one denied, speaks volumes about the reach of INOVA. Their ad this past weekend in the WaPo Loudoun Extra raised my eyebrows, and Ric James at Hooda Thunk dissects it here. I though Republicans are all for open markets and competition? Loudoun’s healthcare system will absolutely not collapse should HCA enter the marketplace. To insinuate otherwise is shameful to the extreme.
UPDATE:Â Excellent column on the monopoly-mongering of INOVA in today’s WaPo by Steve Pearlstein (link here).
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Feb 28th by Loudoun Insider
HAHA! “NON-PROFIT”!
What a phony moniker especially for THIS organization! What it really means is the guys on the board, who have a massive vested financial interest, are attempting to disable the free markets so they can profit.
Like so many “free market capitalists”, these guys have absolutely no interest in free markets unless they’re on the winning end. The rest of the time is spent lobbying against and acquiring competitors, thereby tearing down the free market.
Pathetic!
A couple of Q’s LI. Does INOVA really have a SODEXO food service contract with Tulloch that they signed a month after he got elected to the BOS? Did Beerman really start a medical imaging company while on the Board that sells stuff to INOVA. Is Senator Mark Herring actually lobbying for INOVA in his current position, did he disclose this?
These are serious accusations, all of which I have read on these various blogs over the years. I really dont know the answers to these questions, but someone needs to. The people of Loudoun are sick of this stuff!
All good questions, Watcher. I’ve heard all the same rumors but don’t have subpoena power to get to the bottom of it. Maybe those that do are looking into this stuff (that obviously doesn’t mean the locals).
The past Inova connections are unreal and I can’t believe what they are doing now. They want to fight HCA and HealthSouth so they can keep their monopoly in Loudoun County – residents should demand competition and the new Board should give it to us. This County is the second wealthiest in the nation and we have only one hospital, that is unacceptable. Broadlands is as good a location as any and it should happen now! Plus the tax money would be a benefit with the budget being a mess.
INOVA puts itself out there as a “non-profit” but it has a very pricey top-heavy management making big bucks, which also spreads around a lot of wealth to local lawyers, PR people, etc.
I’ve seen figures that they earned around $250 million in profit and their CEO makes a cool million a year. All while paying no taxes to Loudoun County. I say it’s time to bring in some competition and forget the charade of INOVA as a “non-profit”. It’s time for them to share the tax burden of all this growth that they support so blatantly.
Competition is good. I go to Reston Hospital anyway.
To the point that Loudoun Hosp. doesn’t pay taxes in Loudoun, I have worked with dozens of low-income residents of Loudoun who are uninsured and recieved emergency medical care ( to all the cynics, that includes both native and foriegn born people). Nonprofit hospitals are required by law to provide charity care in return for millions in local and federal tax breaks they recieve. Working with Loudoun Hospital is like pulling teeth. They do not offer charity care as an option, even in the most dire of circumstances. In my experience it takes a professional advocate to even get an application for a patient. What they do almost without exception is offer a payment plan WITH interest. That is not to say that every application should be approved, but every low-income uninsured person should be able to at least apply, which won’t happen if they aren’t even informed of their opportunity. National studies have suggested that non-profit hospitals don’t offer significantly more (and in some cases less) charity care than for profit hospitals.
Loudoun Hospital has been very generous to some non-profits by offering office space and contributions but the cynic in mean wonders if that is because they get publicity for that while the uninsured individual with thousands of dollars in medical bills will go unnoticed.
In fairness, I wonder what the total in charity care awarded by Inova is compared to the total tax breaks and compared to other N. VA hospitals, both private and non profit.
Interestingly, I recently received this email from a Donna Fortier, who turns out (upon Googling her) is the community affairs specialist for Inova Loudoun Hospital, BUT DOESN’T SAY THAT IN THIS EMAIL!!! Here it is in parts:
“Hi everyone,
…As you also may know, many residents have agreed to have an attorney represent them and have their interests heard (through the attorney) to the Board of Supervisors, informing them that we are still a very active and vocal group that still oppose HCA’s plans. (If any of you are interested in being added to that growing list of residents that are represented by council, PLEASE LET ME KNOW AND I WILL ADD YOUR NAME. (emphasis added by me))
…As I had mentioned in previous emails, we need to get ready during the March or April time frame to go en mass to the Board of supervisors to let them know we are still opposed. That time has come… we need you and your family and friends to join us on March 3rd, 6:30pm at 1 Harrison street. This is the only opportunity we have as a community to show our opposition about this hospital plan to the Board of Supervisors prior to the trial starting on March 10th…
…We have not had to rally for almost a year (or even 2) and we can no longer sit back. This is a very important meeting and one of our last chances (if not the last chance) to state our opposition against this plan…
…Please let me know that you are able to attend and let me know if you have any questions or concerns…
…We are looking for a few people to speak to the Board of Supervisors that night just to let them know this is not the right location. We are looking at having speakers from the Route 50 corridor also speak informing the board that route 50 is the right location.
… thank you for your commitment in seeing that NO HOSPITAL is built in Broadlands.
Thanks, Donna Fortier”
I find it very interesting that Ms. Fortier’s email JUST asks for people who want to be added to the list and DOES NOT ask for any cash.
The attorney in question consistently introduces herself as a LITIGATOR representing concerned citizens of Loudoun. Who’s money is she speaking for? The inference within Ms. Fortier’s letter certainly leads me to believe it ain’t the citizens she proclaims to represent.
I believe Rhonda Paice is now representing this “group of residents.” I wonder who is paying the bill? Anybody want to bet it is Inova?
Inova made 1.8 BILLION dollars profit last year. No wonder they will use every trick to keep out competition.
Their latest full page ads are shameful.
Much to Donna’s chagrin, there are lots of residents of Broadlands who support the hospital.
Well what I find curious the above post signed jur “Broardlands” does not identify themselves, so it could be posted by anyone including someone that works for the HCA who have an office in the broadlands.
I do believe we need another hospital but feel the broadlands locationd is not the correct place to build one. It should be built just south of Brambleton so it could serve both the rt 50 corridor as well as the broadlands which will be built just across some very expensive homes. The HCA also has set aside reserve land just directly across the residential which is not included in their final build out. So even tho they say they are building why into the site this large piece of reserve land is right on top of broadlands Blvd and very close to the residential. My concern is HCA is not totaly upfront on how all the land will be developed.
I also have heard that even tho the helipad has been taken out they are going to in the future try to get it back in. I think this pice of property is a slippery slope if this hospital is approved there.
Just to make it very clear I don not know any of the INOVA or HCA hospital administrators.
I have been both to INOVA and HCA hospitals in Reston and Landsdown and found the care to be equally good.
JUst like the new Visa Industrial complex being built on prime Class A land across from One Loudoun could have a major negative effect in that location and hurting the possibility to continue the One Loudoun theme all along rt 7 from One Loudoun to the dulles town center. Now we have an industrial complex right in the middle and homes off 606 in the middle of where the industial should be. So the planning in this county is becoming severely out of whack. I do believe these poor planning decisions will come back to bite this county in the ass someday. The economic development business brochure only shows pictures of the beautiful class A developments not these industrial complexes that are jumping out of the corral into places that would be better suited to class A development.
This hospital is needed just not in that location.
Lee j
I don’t really see the ‘inova thwarts all competition argument’. More so, I think they are just opposed to the location of that new hospital.
Correct me if I am wrong- but hasn’t HCA had a lawsuit against Loudoun County for a couple of years now? Why in that time frame have they not simply built some place else? What other efforts has HCA made to simply get along or compromise with the County, and simply move elsewhere?
It just seems for all the years HCA has been suing Loudoun, they could have been making an effort to bring healthcare to the county in other ways, in other places. Instead, at least looking from the outside- in- it looks like its HCA’s way or no way at all. And when HCA didn’t get their way, they went to the courts.
OO – they have been involved in a lawsuit on the decisions made by the last board that was clearly tied up – as LI shows us above – in the GOBN. How can’t you see how they are trying to thwart competition? Doesn’t the email above and the full page ads show that?
Lee J, sorry sir you are wrong about your wild accusation and i didn’t originate the email, Inova employees did, just pointed out some interesting parts.
I have not accused anyone of anything except I don’t think HCA is anymore being honest about the true potential of the build out of all their land there not just the final build out they are showing or the helipad which I believe and have heard they will fight to get back in once they get the initial approval. So HCA is not being totally forthright in my opinion of their ultimate intentions for the broadband site. More people far from the INOVA hospital especially on the rt 50 corridor would be better severed by a location south of Brambleton and away from homes. You sign your name the broadlands so who knows who you are you could be anyone including an employee of the HCA that is all I am pointing out. I know who Blackout and Cliff are and many others here but we don’t know you that is all. No more no less. I am for HCA to build a hospital just not in that location so more loudoun residents can have closer access then in the broadlands location.
TB- No, doesnt show that at all. The ad doesnt say “HCA don’t come to Loudoun”, but does say that if a hospital is built in Broadlands, folks on Rt.50 and in the Western parts of Loudoun are going to go without close-by access to health care services.
And don’t play that GOBN card, I wasn’t born yesterday. So what? The new members of the board of supervisors who all received monetary contributions by HCA, funnelled throught Voters for Loudouns Future, aren’t the NEW GOBN? Please. The VLF Treasurer now even spoke in front of the board supporting BRMC. She had her price– do the new board members have theirs?
I’m not trying to take sides, exactly the opposite actually. I just think INOVA is saying (in statements and in that ad) that if Broadlands is built, it is going to cut directly into their bottom-line. So what- its a bottom-line. Its still a business, and it still has to make money. So with two hospitals practically on top of one another, both are going to do okay. Not great. Not gang-busters. But simply, okay.
If INOVA is simply doing okay, then their now longer going to have those deep pockets you all claim they have to re-invest and expand in and around the county.
HCA will simply be doing okay as well. My point in my previous post was, that HCA hasn’t shown any indication, any effort at all, that they’ll bring anything other medical services to the County other than BRMC. (you could rebute that they too have property on Rt.50, like INOVA- but again I ask; What have they done with that property since they purchased it? Answer; As much as they’ve done at Broadlands–nothing.
Really, I find it funny. Those few folks on here that are saying they drive 30 mins to a hospital (regardless of it being 30 miles or 5 miles) think they have it bad. They want a hospital right down at the end of their driveway. Yet, think what that’ll do to the folks in Lovettsville, Purceville, Middleburg, and parts even further west? Those folks are not only going to have a 30 minute trip to the Emergency Room, but their still going to have that same 30 minute trip for something even routine?
If i lived in Loudoun, I’d rather have things more spreadout.
I’ll add on the ad. That looking at it again, Inova, or HCA for that matter, is not going to build 100+ bed hospitals at all these locations- those facilities will all vary in size and scope.
The claim to “build the next hospital where the population is” is flawed. Health care services aren’t limited to only 100+ bed hospitals. There are urgent care centers, remotely located ER’s, medical offices, etc.
Again, I’d rather have a number of health care facilities offering all the basics to everyone, equally and evenly, then two identical and massive facilities nestled up in the northeast corner of Louduon County.
What reason would a non-profit hospital have for running an extremely misleading and expensive ad in the Wash Post this past weekend if they weren’t attempting to limit competition? How can Inova’s Board authorize the expenditure of funds attempting to limit competition? It’s unAmerican to limit competition.
HCA has the only valid Certificate of Need issued by the Commonwealth permiting the construction of a new hospital in the county. And, that is for the Broadlands location.
My family and I live between Aldie and Arcola. A hospital in Broadlands would be a significant improvment for us. It’s half the distance to the Broadlands location as it is to the Inova location outside Leesburg.
Let’s stop wasting time and money and end the troubling and questionable spending spree by the non-profit hospital in the county…competition is what made America great. Build the HCA hospital in Broadlands.
How about this: build em all and stop fighting over it?
It is SHAMEFUL that Randy Kelly CEO of INOVA Loudoun stated to the BoS…
“(if brmc is built) you will not see a hospital on the Route 50 corridor in my life time”…who the hell does this guy think he is?
Mr. Kelly is holding hostage – future improvements to current facilities (Cornwall Loudoun) as well as future medical campuses and continues to opine about the validity of HCA’s COPN. Mr. Kelly & his Inova cabal continue their fear mongering and monopolistic tactics all for the bottom line of Inova, while the residents of Loudoun continue to seek better healthcare outside the county.
Come on give me a break – seems like he has a touch of a “God-like” complex, it’s pretty obvious that our population to hospital bed ratio is woefully below the national average and Loudoun residents could benefit from an additional Inova Campus and BRMC.
Outside Observer-
Actually, HCA is moving forward with their property on Rte 50. The property was recently zoned to allow for a hospital, via “special exception”, and I think that request will be filed in the next few months.
If BRMC is approved, it will be interesting to see how fast either company moves forward with their projects.
Outside Observer , here’s your correction.
HCA owns the piece of property, and the property conforms with the configuration of Fairfax’s many hospitals. It is preferable to cluster the hospitals in the population centers, and as has been determined, there are already plenty of customers in place to support 3 hospitals. INOVA has wrangled and twisted rules and come as close as an organization can come to breaking laws and not being prosecuted (see Tate dilemma for the reasons they won’t be prosecuted).
INOVA had a nefariously nepatistic relationship with 5 of the last BOS, and were attempting to get a slamdunk with Ryan’s son in the running for 2008, because Tulloch had begun to slip out and distance himself from their scheme.(which makes him a very smart man, I might add)
I didn’t start out cheering for BRMC, but after seeing everything that INOVA is throwing at them, as well as finding out over the past 4 years who sits on their Board and who is tossing the rocks… If they don’t want BRMC here, it is probably in our best interest to get BRMC in here ASAP.
Outside Observer … you also lost me on your numerous postings above.
In one post, you offer: “Yet, think what that’ll do to the folks in Lovettsville, Purceville, Middleburg, and parts even further west? Those folks are not only going to have a 30 minute trip to the Emergency Room, but their still going to have that same 30 minute trip for something even routine? ”
And in another you point out that:
“Health care services aren’t limited to only 100+ bed hospitals. There are urgent care centers, remotely located ER’s, medical offices, etc.”
So, having pointed out that Purcellville has an UrgentCare facility, another recently built medical services building , and now that Lovettsville will soon recieve an INOVA facility in their town, too….
What was the real scope of your offering?
Erika-
(Wow- I’m really starting to carry the Inova water here, but again, will step up and quash a myth.)
“Beds per thousand” is an absolutely ridiculous method of measurement. Since when does the influence and efforts of any business, especially healthcare, begin and end at magisterial, county or state lines? It never does.
Using your logic, why doenst HCA then want to build a hospital in Clarke County? They have 0 (ZERO) beds per thousand in that County?
If I get in an accident down at South Riding I hope that the ambulance driver takes me to Fair Oaks. If I’m in Oak Grove, or parts of Sterling I hope that ambulance driver takes me to Reston.
Building a hospital in Broadlands won’t change either of those scenarios.
Same with ‘50% of Loudoun residents leave the County for health care’. Well duh? I work in DC. and I try as much as I can to schedule my doctors appts during my lunch break. Am I, because BRMC is built, now going to try and drive all the way back to Loudoun, see my doc, then back to DC in an hour? In two hours? Heck no. I don’t see a dentist in Loudoun. I don’t see my eye doc, or my general family physician in Loudoun, or receive any health care needs there. Not because I don’t want to, but simply because my life and job doesnt afford me the time too. I’m willing to bet there are a ton of folks in my same situation- at least all those that I drive next to, to work each and every day with. That statistic isn’t going to change one single percentage point if BRMC is built- not one.
Doctors offices, like every other business, are 9-5. And that’ll never work with anyones schedule who commutes to the city, or even fairfax for that matter. Similarly, no one can ever predict where and when they are going to get in an accident. Folks like me are probably even more likely to get injured or hurt OUTSIDE Loudoun County, then in it, because of my travel and location of place of work.
Buidling a hospital in Broadlands makes as much sense as all these percentages and statistics HCA has marketed out to the public. (zero) Put it on Rt. 50.
Outside…I don’t think you are an “outsider” anymore.
Regarding this little jewel:
“The new members of the board of supervisors who all received monetary contributions by HCA, funnelled throught Voters for Loudouns Future, aren’t the NEW GOBN? Please. The VLF Treasurer now even spoke in front of the board supporting BRMC. She had her price– do the new board members have theirs?”
I’m afraid I’m gonna have to call you on this nonsense. Many here know that I was on the original executive committee for the VLF, and actually stayed close thruout the elections even after I resigned from the organization.
You’re either repeating crap from someone who couldn’t find their rear with a GPS, both hands and a flashlight, or you just made it up and thought it’d sound clever. Now I’m asking you to back it up, or face being discredited as an outright liar. Which would it be??
60% of all accidents occur within 10 miles of home.
10ft. Tall-
Its pretty easy to follow along. I made the point, actually twice.
If you cut INOVA’s bottom line (see comment at 4:33), being a non-profit, they’ll most likely scale back on further investment in the county. (thats what non-profits do- reinvest their what profits they do make)
Right now, there are at least INOVA plans to go to Lovettsville, Rt.50, Middleburg, etc- but who is to say that they’ll maintain that strategy of branching out (”delivering health care” I think is their official term) once those profits earmarked for reinvestment are limited or even disappear?
As to HCA- I stated that they’ve made little to no effort in doing anything other than buying property and suing the county in the past, what–5-6 years? If they were really committed to “delivering healthcare” to Loudoun County, you’d think that they would have done something, somewhere, by now? They haven’t. Which makes me question HCA’s real committment.
10ft. Tall-
Its called the Virginia Public Access Project. Its pretty cool – you should check it out.
http://www.vpap.org
Specific to my argument: Here is how much money VLF Gave to each Candidate:
(Buckley-$7500, Burk-$5,700, Burton-$3200, Kurtz-$9100, McGimsey $6500, Miller $16,000, Waters-$10,000)
http://www.vpap.org/donors/results_level2.cfm?Key=ORP000243217
No surprise Stevens leads them all in– BRMC is in his district- coincidence, I think not.
ANd here is how much HCA gave to VLF ($9,500 for 2007 alone):
http://www.vpap.org/donors/pac_donors1.cfm?ComID=06-068&FmKey=ORP000243217
10 ft Tall and Bulletproof- more like- 5 ft Tall and Waterproof.
Lee J – since you are so busy trying to figure out who’s who, wanna take a stab at who Outside Observer is? Seems only fair and balanced!
More is certainly better. There is nothing to the ridiculous argument that building BRMC hurts health care in Loudoun…simply illogical. If Inova can’t build it someone else will if there is the demand.
Ericka keen observation about some of the things Inova has been saying in public.
HCA COULD NOT do anything with the former Board in place. It can be argued, however, that Tulloch was getting soft (by INOVA’s GOBN’s interpretation) and that HCA merely need to see Ryan lose, and they’d get a vote up in the next season. Before that, the previous Board had the lid on hospitals SLAMMED SHUT.
One point of clarification on the above statements by me regarding the HCA funds “funneled” through VLF.
There was no funneling, and there was no coersion of the “treasurer”. She is a singular person, and entitled to her opinion, unlike those who actually are employed by INOVA and do not reveal that impoerrtant fact.
All moneies that passed thru the VLF were entirely proper and reported, and visible on vpap.org. Impying that there were funds “funneled” in any other way is not only distasteful, but libelous.
OO-
Well, I can see where your point of view comes from. You’ve completely bought Inova’s spin without question.
As I said before, where are the western healthplexes they proposed years ago?
Still nowhere? Oh yeah….they’ll build them later.
Do a population census……the majority of Loudoun county is “nestled in the northeast corner.”
Inova will continue to invest in Loudoun County with or without BRMC. If they choose not to, HCA and HealthSouth will be more than happy to pick up the slack.
Look at all the improvements at Loudoun Hospital just with the proposal of competition.
By any measured standard, and I’ve talked to many medical professionals that don’t have a dog in this fight, and one hospital and less than 200 beds for a population of 270,000 is significantly low.
This doesn’t even take into account the additional doctors and specialists this area desparately needs that another full service hospital will bring in.
TB lets start with Erica and Cliff are public figures first they are on the Broadlands HOA Cliff is president. They both are appointed for several committees by our county supervisor Stevens Miller. I know them both and they are hard workers but I believe when you take stands on controversially projects and you are an public figure you should state that. They both are very very vocal supporters for this hospital and that is fine, but they still should identify who they are like Donna when you are a public figure. Everyone has their opinion and have right to it. But you are all jumping down on Donna who I have never met yet she identifies who she is.
I see nothing wrong with INOVa’s add and the HCA did a lot of advertising before the BOS voted no for them to build on this location. The previous board did not have a problem with another hospital just the location and HCA needs an special exemption to build there. Further when you have a large plot of land in reserve on this property and say they have no idea what they are going to do with it when the final build is done or before. I feel that is disingenuous as they could go for an 100 tall building later there directly across from the residential. Same goes with the helipad. If they really wanted the public to fully understand the impact of their buildings on the surounding residential . Then build an massing model of the entire build out with the surrounding residential and commercial including an place holder for the reserve land. And also do an animated video of the entire project so everyone can understand the visuals and impact on the surrounding residential. This is done by architects all the time when they are trying to sell an very controversial project. It is a drop in the bucket compared to the entire cost of this hospital. As far as an hospital that would serve the most people thAT ARE NOT NEAR inova This hospital should be built south of Brambleton on land not close to the non urban residential like INOVA is in landsdown. That location would better serve the residents that are not closest to the present INOVA .
Yes I would like to know if watcher is connected to any of these hospitals or is in the public eye all the time like Cliff and Erica and Blackout.
I love all this people I mentioned and they do a good job in their public roles. I personally am not in the public eye or am I connected in anyway with either hospital. I come from an different direction in my opinions that the zoning in this county is slowly going to hell and it is mostly the developers that have done the superb job in the PUDs of zoning and keeping the county beautiful. Our county officials and their planners are letting us down project after project in the land in between the large developer PUD’s especially by the by right developments. This hospital is just another example of a controversial project being forced by the few upon the many and it needs a special exemption to be built. It would of been granted by the previous board if it was worthy of one. Moving this hospital south of Brambleton would do far more good for the public especially the people off rt fifty that are not near an hospital. Most of the future residential growth in loudoun is closer Brambleton then it is to the broadlands.
I didn’t mean 100 tall buildings I meant a building could possibly be 100 ft tall on that reserve land on Broadlands blvd directly across from the suburban style residential. By the way Cylde’s does an wonderful job in site placement and design as a transition from commercial to residential.
For anyone interested here is an thread about this hospital that has been going on for years.
http://www.broadlandshoa.org/hoaforum/showthread.php?t=33&highlight=hospital
That whole ad by Inova was a fraud. I can’t believe they have lowered themselves to these tactics. They seem desperate to hold onto their healthcare monopoly.
We need a second major hospital and we needed it yesterday. I would love to see HCA get their hospital built – and built where the state health people determined it should be built. A location change at this point would be counter productive and not happen for years. If anyone wanted it in a different location, you should have gotten involved back before the COPN was issued.
The former Board of Supervisors were a good ol boys club and somehow Inova inherited that status from Loudoun Hospital. It’s time for the fair thing to happen. HCA should build their hospital. We will all be better off. I’d also love to see their taxes contributed to our commerical tax base. We’ve lost millions with all this delay.
It’s time for Loudoun County to send a clear message. We are a professional, open, and fair County that welcomes business.
Well said Perfect Timing. Lee J, you didn’t answer TB’s question though. You only called out the pro-BRMC people, LOL.
OO…. read above clarification. You said FUNNELED. All of those links support exactly what I made reference to. The money listed in them is clearly in the sunshine. There is transparency for anyone who wants to see it.There is no hiding, there is no funneled money.
And FWIW, if I were HCA and had gotten shot down as the one exception that the previous board ruled over, I’d have figured out that I might want to back a different horse, too.
The fingerprints of the GOBN were all over that vote(Or at least one big fat thumb held it down), and HCA did not stand an honest chance while those supervisors were in office. Things are much better now.
Trust us…A LOT of things improved when the four former members of the LCBOS left the building. We’ll be years cleaning up the mess.
Lee..
I’m vocal, and I’m one person. Oh….crap!!!! I have an appointment to the Agriculture Committee!!!!!! You think I shouldn’t be able to voice my personal opinion as an individual??
Lee, I would be more than happy to continue our debate on the Broadland’s Forum, (#34) but I can’t. I have been censored and banned from that forum because of my opinions and support of the Broadland’s Hospital.
I guess I was getting to close to the truth.
Further, from what I have heard, a HOA Board member was behind the effort to ban me from the debate. Now I am not sure which board member it was, but a would make a good guess it is the HOA board member who is also a paid member of the Inova staff.
The record is not a pretty one for Inova and their PR organization.
OK guys I am not defending INOVA, although we have used both HCA in reston and inova in landsdown for some minor stuff and could not see any difference in care both were good. I have designed homes for doctors that are affiliated to both hospitals and they are all excellent doctors. 10 feet I am glad you made that disclosure
I feel much better now. 
Blackout I was wondering what happened to you my good friend. ha ha It is an miracle I think I have not been kicked off there as of yet. Maybe if I keep challenging Cliff and Erica too much I be be gone soon also ha ha ha
I have said pretty much what I have to say about the hospital. We need another hospital I just wish they would of chose a less controversial site and one that would serve more people not close to INOVA in the fastest growing part of the county where a good part of and most residential will take place.
# 24 – Don’t drink the water – it’s tainted like Jonestown cool-aid… ïÂÅ
If your opinion that factors methodology such as beds per thousand1 is an “absolute ridiculous†argument and then throwing in a less populated county such as Clarke2 is a contradiction – sorry you can’t have it both ways.
1) In affect stating guidelines issued by HHS and the Commonwealth are discard eligible. COPN’s are typically issued based on these numbers as well as numerous other factors.
2) Clarke Co. is in no way a valid comparison of Loudoun – biggest factor is population density.
However you make a valid point, you choose to have your care close to work, I choose to leave Loudoun county for healthcare as my time (like everyone else’s) is valuable and waiting several hours in the ER/ED just to be examined and then sent to Ffx b/c LHI didn’t not have the capacity is unacceptable. LHI has made drastic and overdue improvements during the past 4 years; however that catalyst was the “fear†of competition. I want competition, more choices and better access to specialized care – wouldn’t you want that same thing for your family?
INOVA has a stranglehold/monopoly on healthcare in NoVa (PW, Arl, Alex, FFX, etc) – giving them the advantage to dictate insurance pay-out rates, etc.
And again – Mr. Kelly crossed the line with his incessant public statements that have offended many Loudoun (not just Broadlands) residents and tainted the purpose of community healthcare.
You are missing my point. I absolute agree that an additional hospital needs to be build on the RT 50 corridor – however Mr. Kelly’s remark “if BRMC is approved/built…no hospital will be built on the RT 50 corridor…in his life time†is extortion at the expense of Loudoun county residents.
#39 – Lee – thank God you found TC – you have used our forum (as a guest) as your wordsmith – rambling septic tank for too long – at this point you might give Ms. Redacted a run for her money.
If you are going to cry martyr at least spell my name correctly, especially when you are attempting to discredit my integrity (as well as Cliff’s)… good God man
…and for the 3rd time I was appointed b/c I have over 11 years in the field and I expressed interest – stop trying to taint Mr. Miller and/or his decisions.
This is beneath you and I certainly wouldn’t consider you a “friend†or someone I know (I’ve met you once in person for less than 90 seconds) – I don’t disparage my “friends†in a public venue such as this, I have the respect for my “friends†to question and voice behind closed doors.
#39 – Lee – thank God you found TC – you have used our forum (as a guest) as your wordsmith – rambling septic tank for too long – at this point you might give Ms. Redacted a run for her money.
If you are going to cry martyr at least spell my name correctly, especially when you are attempting to discredit my integrity (as well as Cliff’s)… good God man
…and for the 3rd time I was appointed b/c I have over 11 years in the field and I expressed interest – stop trying to taint Mr. Miller and/or his decisions.
This is beneath you and I certainly wouldn’t consider you a “friend†or someone I know (I’ve met you once in person for less than 90 seconds) – I don’t disparage my “friends†in a public venue such as this, I have the respect for my “friends†to question and voice behind closed doors.
I think a few of the above posters made the salient point…in terms of hospital allegiance, all we have done is kick out a BOS closely tied to Inova and installed a BOS closely tied to HCA. Its equally shady, you just have to give the new board some time to prove it (but follow the money…)
This debate ignores a central thing–what the community wants. It has been clear from the start that the Broadlands community is opposed to BRMC. For whatever reason they did it, the BOS ultimately made a decision that was supported by the community and frankly made sense from an administrative standpoint.
I’ve got absolutely no dog in this fight other than common sense. I’ve always thought that was Inova’s strongest argument: it makes very little sense to build a hospital in Broadlands, and all the sense in the world to build one on Route 50. The fastest growing communities in Loudoun are Brambleton, Stoneridge and South Riding. Loudoun Hospital is not particularly convenient to any of them. Broadlands would be MORE convenient, sure…but LESS convenient than a Route 50 location would be. Plus, a 50 location would be much better for anyone who lives out that corridor. You’d also get people from Chantilly and that end of Fairfax County, which you wouldn’t get in Broadlands.
And NOBODY works in Broadlands…a lot more people work on the 50 corridor.
It matters less which entity builds it, but we need a hospital on 50.
In terms of track record…lets face it…if you have anything serious wrong with you, its Inova Fairfax or bust around here. I’m not trusting my life to Loudoun OR Reston. Especially Reston. I’m going to where the big boys play.
Erika M. Hodell-Cotti I have posted on this blog for a long time way before Stevens Miller was elected. Girl you always have a tendency to go off on some rant when you don’t like what you hear. Sometimes to an extreme. I have always said Mr Miller has so far done an excellent job. I don’t understand why you have gone off the deep end here, all I was saying is if you volunteer in public service then you have a responsibility to say so. Donna has been very up front about her alliances and makes no secret about it. I have never met Donna but at least she is up front.
I have no clue why you are so upset and have gone of into this rant, but that is your privilege in living in a free society. My opinions are just that. I have no alliances with either hospital or do I have any public position.
I have given you a compliment about your public service and respect that. I also respect Cliff and have said publically, I feel Stevens Miller has done an excellent job on the BOS.
The tough decisions are still in front of the BOS such as taxes and this Hospital. Mr miller represents the entire Dulles district not just the broadlands so he has has a tough decision on this hospital because he also represents the rt 50 constituents which desperately want a hospital closer to them, that is why I have always suggested as a compromise somewhere south of Brambleton. Whatever decision Mr Miller makes I will always respect it even if I disagree. But Erika I am beginning to wonder about you when you go off saying things about me that are just not true how I feel about Mr Miller or you or Cliff just because I don’t agree with you and Cliff on this hospital site.
Calm down girl, my opinions are well thought out for the good of the entire county not just the few. I may not spell or use as good a grammar as you but I don’t think constantly about how the place I live and love can grow beautifully and correctly so as to not hurt the future of Loudoun. So Erika stop putting in in-correct information on how I feel about Mr Miller. I am not tainting Mr Miller one bit so stop putting words as to how I feel. You have your opinion which I respect and I have my opinion.
as you but I DO (don’t) think constantly about how the place I live and love can grow beautifully and correctly so as to not hurt the future of Loudoun.
Correction I meant to say do NOT don’t in my above post
Nova – you should clarify your statement to “some in the community don’t want it”. Anybody will be opposed to any development no matter what.
Lee-Can you let us know of where your site “south of Brambleton” is that isn’t in the transition area, is not planned/sold for houses or retail, and already has the necessary infrastructure in place? Your elementary arguments about simply moving a location shows how far removed you are from reality; Don’t you think that perhaps a few people from HCA have already done the due diligence to determine a proper site? And by the way, most of the future residential growth is in Brambleton and north of Brambleton along the Greenway. You have been so eager for your “good developer buddy projects” you should know where the real growth is going to be concentrated. Can we put little people in your special models you want HCA to build and play with them too? dont forget the toy helicopter and the little sick people.
I’ve worked directly across from Reston hospital for 5 years now and boy, that place has really become a ghetto-inflicted, traffic-filled nightmare, with medical waste strewn everywhere. I hear more noise from neighborhood dogs than I do from that hospital and oh the traffic! Gosh, I think I have been stuck behind maybe 5 cars at a stoplight when traveling to and from FFX CO parkway.(j/k).
Build the new hospital where the residents are and where housing is being built not where you would like housing to be built. Broadlands is in the heart of Loudoun’s population growth. Rt. 50 is in the Transition Area and we don’t want more housing there. Don’t try to use the notion of a hospital on Rt. 50 as leverage from seeking higher housing densities on Rt. 50.
Lee J you still haven’t answered the question – you want to out so many people… but not Outside Observer…
Anyway, open up the Post today and take a look at the Business Section front page: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/02/28/AR2008022803723.html?hpid=sec-health
Yeap. Good ole’ non-profit Inova…
I live in Brambleton at the southern end. I can tell you that getting from my home up to Broadlands takes about 5 minutes in a straight shot up Belmont Ridge Road. Thats a cakewalk in comparison to going to Route 50 – especially after the big-box developments of Arcola Center and Wal-Mart are built (which I just found out about via a flyer in my mailbox, now thats something the Board should reject). With young kids, I’d rather not put thier health at risk because I’m stuck behind a bunch of delivery trucks and retail traffic. With all the units approved in Brambleton, I would think the hospital in Broadlands would provide enough access for us alone. Brambletonians are growing tired of being overlooked quite a bit because the debate seems to be about serving Dulles South-Route 50 and Ashburn (Broadlands north). This would be a first step to show decisions are being made for us as well.
Lee-
What does my role on an HOA have to do with my opinion on the hospital? Answer: nothing.
What does my appointment to the County FSM by Stevens Miller have to do with my well established opinion about the hospital, especially since Mr. Miller has never voted or stated his opinion about BRMC? Nothing.
Donna is employed by Inova. What does that have to do with her opinion? EVERYTHING.
She also become “up front” about her disclosure after being spoken to twice by our HOA attorney.
Lastly, everyone who reads blogs knows who “vacliff” is. There is no attempt to hide behind anonymity, which is why I use the same name.
So, Lee, why don’t you know call out all the other anonymouis posters, such as Outside Observer. Oh…wait….you wouldn’t do that..they have the same opinion as you. You’re tactics are about as transparent as a window.
Another article about Inova in today’s Washington Post titled “Inova Follows the Money.” It discusses Inova’s “profit margins that would make any hospital proud, nonprofit Inova has been aggressive in extending its near monopoly to outpatient services.”
Their greed knows no bounds.
A third party firm estimated that HCA Broadlands will create over 3.5 million dollars of tax revenue to Loudoun County PER YEAR.
HCA has offered to expand Belmont Ridge Road from two to four lanes from the hospital site to Briar Woods H.S. The County should appreciate that offer based on the current cost estimate for the widening of Belmont Ridge Road.
Tax revenue from Loudoun Hospital/Inova. ZERO. ZERO times the years Inova has been in the county is still ZERO. Absolutely no tax revenue is or will be generated from Inova.
For a County that is challenged by the current tax base I see absolutely no reason to deny a large tax paying employer like HCA. For that matter the welcome mat should be out with fanfare.
From Dean
“The fingerprints of the GOBN were all over that vote(Or at least one big fat thumb held it down), and HCA did not stand an honest chance while those supervisors were in office. Things are much better now.
Trust us…A LOT of things improved when the four former members of the LCBOS left the building”.
I do belive the HCA vote was a party line vote with ALL six GOP (not just four) voting against the HCA application. Burton and Kurtz have been very clear why they voted in favor of HCA. Maybe we need to know why Waters and Delgaudio voted against the last time and if their opinion has since changed.
Nobody bans my friend BlackOut–nobody. He speaks with reason, reasonably; he speaks forthrightly, rightly and he speaks with wisdom wisely.
This is a test, because I’m being ‘moderated’ often by the kid and I wanted to see if this would fly–BTW, I do respect BlackOut–that was not sarcasm.
I guess TC wants little ole Jose to take his marbles somewhere else to play.
Lee – wonder all you want – remember you are the one who started to drag both cliff and myself into your mud-bath- and then retracted your comments about Mr. Miller on the forums. However those have already been archived prior to your editing and deletion.
Eugene is Eugene.
But this time, he’s been effectively nuetered. His vote doesn’t count, and Lori wouldn’t even need to be put on the spot. There are more than enough votes without these two to carry HCA.
anon- my guess – follow the money trail…lcrc, inova etc
If folks are going to put the dems in the spotlight – its only fair to do the same to the gop.
Cliff read my post I did say observer should identify themselves and any others.
I just think when you take such a strong stand on an issue such as this hospital and you have public positions such as an member of an HOA board as president or any position on the board and you are also have taken an public position on an committee with an elected public official you should disclose that. Just like you call out Donna all the time. What the difference????
Erica I can’t edit or delete anything on this blog. And why do you all take such offense that that someone feels you should disclose your public jobs which I am sure you all do extremely well. Cliff you know you have a very close relationship to this hospital including the entire set of plans, which for some reason they will not give to me to study, but you can.
What is up with that???????? As an resident of this county I should be able to make my opinion based on all the information not just what is cherry picked for the public view.
Sorry that both you think I am on some kind of witch hunt which I am not. I just want all the facts not just the ones HCA wants the public to see. I want to know their intent for the reserve land across the street from single family homes. I want to know their true intent for the helipad. And much information can be
obtained from an detailed set of plans for that site. Much information can be realized from massing models and animated videos as to the true impact on the site and surrounding area. This is done all the time on controversial sites. What are they so afraid of??? Why are you so cautious about disclosing your public service and for who. Donna certainly makes no bones about who she is. I have never met her.
I have questions that have not been entirely answered to my satisfaction. I have asked for information which I have not received.
So what is the big secret about everything????
Non of this should be a big deal, you are all making it into this big deal. I have not received enough information so I can come before the board to state my opinion intelligently with facts and answers that are being kept from me and others.
Erica and Cliff I respect the work you are doing for the Broadlands and your respective committees for the residents of Loudoun and the dulles district. But I do have the right to state my opinion as an resident of this county just like you do. And I do not hold any public position in this county and I think public positions are important to be disclosed, certainly no witch hunt like you think I am making this out to. I do fully support my county supervisor Stevens Miller even if someday I disagree with some vote or position he takes even if I do not agree with it, it does not mean I am tainting him or anything else. I voted for him and I am still glad I did .
Dean, what a strange statement,
“Eugene is Eugene. But this time, he’s been effectively nuetered. His vote doesn’t count, and Lori wouldn’t even need to be put on the spot. There are more than enough votes without these two to carry HCA”.
Every elected official should be “put on the spot” and respondsible for their votes. Even if they are the only one to vote for or against an issue. Usually you are one who belives in accountability, Strange comment coming from you.
Lee –
I was speaking of your history on the Broadlands forum.
What I find ironic: you – yes only you are the one who resurrected a thread that was dormant for 3 years and your statements consistently contradicted themselves. Then you found TC and brought (almost verbatim the same thoughts here) – difference audience – but same content material and debate patterns…transparent.
The heli-pad, location, COPN etc was explained over and over. You just didn’t like the answer on the Broadlands site and brought the same fear-mongering over to TC and I am calling stink on it.
Seriously Lee – you are giving Ms. Redacted a run for her money in the word game and I think that you are better than this.
While I can appreciate your sense of atonement in the acknowledgement of the hours Cliff puts into our community – however Cliff & I are NOT compensated for our hours of volunteer time to the county or Broadlands, while Donna is paid a king’s ransom for her services as PR Dir for LHI.
Erica you are entitled to your opinion just like I am and everybody else. But it would be nice to have the complete set of plans to the hospital like others do that fully support it like Cliff. Further massing models of the entire build out as well as an place holder of maximum size on the reserve land since they say they don’t know what they are going to do with it and it is not included in their final build. Also an animated video so we can see the true impact on the adjoining properties and beyond since these are fairly tall buildings and will affect visuals from properties even further away then just the adjoining ones.
I do not believe I was the one that resurrected the hospital controversy on the broadlands forum.
So what is your solution censor me and others that disagree with you and Cliff???????
Lee, if you are in such dyer need of plans, massing models, and animated videos for this hospital, why in the world are you talking out of the other side of your mouth with opinionated conclusions?
It is nice to have a hospital… I am all for that, just NOT in this neighborhood.
No hospital in Broadlands – HCA or Inova
no thanks
HCA is just interested in being in the most congested area of A-burn so it can make more $$$$ – duh!
we do not need a hospital within 4 miles of another hospital for any reason.
Blackout has been banned from Broadlands forum? That’s outrageous. Blackout is a reasonable, thoughtful poster. This action makes them look small and petty. Also, makes you wonder what they are so afraid of?
Hope it means we see more of Blackout here.
Mr blackout because of the information they are letting the public see draws to those conclusions.
If they want us to come to the conclusions they want us to then let us have all the information. Otherwise it looks like they are hiding things and maybe even the hospital does not want to know what conclusions the massing models and videos will lead to. This way without them they can avoid even further scrutiny of what they are telling us.
Big projects especially ones as controversial as this one go to great lengths to sell the public with as many tools at their disposal they can and that includes massing models and animated videos. Other cities and towns have their entire city and buildings already put into videos, so when a new development is proposed the architect or designer can plug their animation of their project into it and it makes it very easy to see how the new development will affect the existing from everything from sun and shade studies and visuals on all the surrounding and even further properties on how they may be affected by this new building and development. I understand the area around our capitals mall already has this kind of animation, but sure how far it extends into the surounding area and city.
Loudoun and the DC tout it self especially loudoun as an high tech corridor so why aren’t using technology that already exist to help understand what new buildings and developments will do to an property far before it is even built. It would go a long ways to know if this is a good neighbor development or bad neighbor development. Renderings just can’t be as accurate as animation videos can be showing far more the affects then any rendering can.
Well let’s examine what information we do know. (64 & 66)
Inova would love to have the public thinking this hospital is located within a congested residential area. Not true.
The location is at the corner of Belmont Ridge Road and the Greenway. Along the north side is six lanes of Greenway. Along the west side is currently two and soon to be four lanes of highway along Belmont Ridge Road. Fronting the hospital along the southern side is four lanes of divided median, on which the other side of is Broadland’s housing. Along the east side is the school Board building and Clydes. Certainly not what is portrayed by Inova and Donna’s letters.
Second point. This is absolutely a perfect progression for a healthcare location in Loudoun. We currently have three major east west corridors. Route 7, the Greenway, and Route 50. As the County has grown it makes perfect sense to have Inova Hospital serve the Route 7 corridor, Broadlands Hospital serve the Greenway corridor, and a to be determined company to provide service on the Rt. 50 corridor.
Most Broadlands hospital traffic will never even go through Broadlands. The current traffic pattern design has vehicles coming off the Greenway, onto Belmont Ridge and then directly into the hospital.
Now if I was Inova I would definately not want this information in the hands of a rational public.
Lee,
By the way, the problem with your logic is you are ONLY evaluating the information, which is really propoganda, from Inova. You must be on Donna’s super-secret email list.
For the life of me, I do not see how people can be blinded into thinking Inova is fighting this for any other reason than to kill competition and preserve their monopoly.
Lee, what are your thoughts on the Washington Post article, that Loudoun Insider has linked to? It is very pertinent to this topic of killing competition and preserving a monopoly.
Blackout I have been always about the location not the hospital. Hospital always expand forever and once they get their claws into the property they on many occasions go to extremes to keep expanding just like they are going to extremes in putting this hospital that has residential adjoining it. Rarely does anything stop an hospital from expanding far beyond any of their original visions or final build out. Besides building it south of brambleton or even fifty gives more people without fairly close access to hospital medical care then the broadlands site. This location just cannibalizes the many of the same people that the inova hospital already serves. Put it south of brambleton and you reach far more people that don’t have close access to inova or any hospital. This hospital will as we all know and don’t kid yourselves the building of an hospital in the rt 50 corridor for a much longer time then if this hospital is not built in the broadlands. I am concerned with more people having closer access to hospital care that do not have it then any monopoly.
Lee,
You have nothing to worry about. If you are worried about expansion, there is no way HCA can expand on this location unless they somehow annex the Greenway, Belmont Ridge Road, Broadlands Parkway, or if they buy the school admin building.
You bring up a bogus argument.
Please address the points so eloquently highlighted in the Washington Post article.
Blackout of course they can expand. First Hospitals are a different animal then most businesses. They are for the public good and use that all the time to expand far beyond any zoning restrictions. They almost always get what they want in expansion. Happens everyday all over the country and even locally.
Hospitals are very unique in the community and development world and almost get anything that want crying it is for the good of the community. Just like Hatrick cries and usually gets close to what he wants in the budget because he cries it is for the good of the chilren. There are virtually few businesses that have that power.
Lets see as far as that site first there is an large reserve area for future something not included in their final build out right across from the residential. Second that have an large parking lot and it would be very easy to build parking garages and add many buildings down the road far beyond the final build out and will cry it is for the good of the community for this expansion. Hospitals do it everyday across the country. You may be fooled by there intentions far in the future, so rather then force their way onto this site find one that will serve far more people that are not close to an hospital and an site that will not affect their neighbors in an negative way.
I’m starting to regret posting about this issue! Let’s try to keep it civil, folks.
INOVA ran their shameful ad in this week’s Loudoun Times Mirror and as the back cover of Leesburg Today. I never had strong opinions on this one way or the other until I really looked hard at that ad – what a bunch of fear mongering BS.
Blackout-
Give it up. Lee will not answer a question no matter how many times you ask.
Lee-
Why on earth would HCA give you anything considering your endless rants and attacks on them?
Why do I have the plans? As you have pointed out about 800 times, I am on the Broadlands HOA. I have been involved in this thing since day one. I have conducted numerous meetings with residents about the hospital and show them the plans.
You continue to demonstrate your complete ignorance about the site, county zoning, expansion possibilities, and the healthcare industry.
Of course, you base these opinions, like all your others, on a complete lack of understanding of the building, zoning and development industry.
I won’t even bother correcting your OPINIONS with FACTS anymore. I’ve tried and tried, but it does no good.
You seem to enjoy blathering YOUR strong opinions everywhere, but don’t like it when I express mine? Screw you.
And yes, you did restart the Broadlands Hospital thread. Post 417 was dated 01/08/04. Post 418 was yours, dated 12/22/07. If that wasn’t enough, you started a new hospital thread on 12/19/07 as well. As usual, you are wrong again.
Stick to drawing your pretty pictures.
Lee,
I can’t argue with irrationality. They are landlocked when it comes to expansion. For you to say “of course” they can expand makes no sense. I am afraid you are bring into question your other judgment calls.
How about that Wash Post article, pretty damning account of Inova’s strategic corporate plan isn’t it?
LI, I just saw the ad referenced. Unbelieveable! Everyone needs to take that bag of lies into context of what Inova is trying to do. Check out the map! You’d think they were drafting this from another country.
#60 I don’t think he’s above accountability. He just isn’t in a position to screw up anything for a while. So I tend not to worry about him. Come next election, we’ll go thru his voting record to bury him.
First of all, HCA is pulling some serious fear-mongering BS themselves in Leesburg Today and other publications…as if their Broadlands hospital means closer “critical care.” Its bs because in an ambulance, its like a five minute drive between Loudoun and were Broadlands would be.
For me, I don’t care WHO builds the hospital so much as WHERE it is built. If HCA were to build a nice big hospital over on Route 50, I’m fine with that. I just think Broadlands is a flat out nonsensical location…its like building a new Ashburn library (which is needed) next to Stone Bridge High School (and notice they aren’t doing that for a reason).
Its just common sense. Spread the facilities out from each other so they can optimize convenience for most people.
As far as Inova, first of all, that WaPo article wasn’t all that…it was pretty cheesy actually. Not to say that Inova sometimes isn’t. But I will give Inova this–for all the trust that the State and local authories have put in them, they’ve held up their end of the bargain as far as I’m concerned. There’s no question that at least the quality of care at Inova facilities is very high. Reston Hospital doesn’t impress me and never has. Fair Oaks is similiar in size and scope, but frankly is probably a superior facility. And as I said, Inova Fairfax is recognized as the best hospital in the entire DC Metro area.
So lets be careful not to hate on Inova too much.
NC,
If close “critical care” is already provided by Loudoun Hospital, why do you think so many “critical cases” end up being hauled to Fairfax? It ain’t about distance.
And for anyone who lives along Route 50 I am sure they favor Fair Oaks, it’s a lot closer than Loudoun.
I live in Ashburn and I favor Reston. The distance argument is bunk.
HCA has invested and has chosen Broadlands. They wouldn’t be pushing that location unless their own economical models had shown positive financial results. The area can support both hospitals.
Rt 50 is not ready to support a full hospital. In fact, both HCA and Inova are on the record stating so.
Libraries are not hospitals. This is not about Briar Woods H.S. and Freedom H.S.
The Rt 50 diversion is nothing more than Inova propaganda. In fact, I would guess Inova is a little embarrassed they dropped the ball on finding another location along the Greenway.
Tell someone in Purcellville or Hamilton that a hospital along Rt 50 is more convenient than one along the Greenway corridor. They’ll laugh at you.
Tell someone in Purcellville or Hamilton that a hospital in BROADLANDS is more convenient than one in Landsdowne…they’ll also laugh at you.
Why would BRMC be any more capable to handle high impact trauma than Reston? The HCA argument is bunk, and so is yours about Fairfax. Fairfax is one of the best trauma hospitals in the entire country–patients are medflighted there, and that isn’t going to change if BRMC gets built. BRMC will be a hospital no more able to handle critical cases than Loudoun, Reston or Inova.
There are a lot of considerations here…a hospital is not like a high school or a library, you’re right. Those things belong in residential neighborhoods. Hospitals don’t. That’s certainly one of the considerations. Broadlands does not have the local infrastructure to support that kind of hospital, Route 50 does. You can’t just stick a major hospital in the middle of the neighborhood and ignore the community’s concerns…and make NO mistake–the VAST majority of people who live in the areas actually affected by this oppose the hospital.
Nova-Rt 50 has more infrastructure to support a hospital than Broadlands?- How is HCA’s plan in the “middle” of the neighborhood”? If hospitals don’t belong next to neighborhoods, does Class A office space? I would really encourage you to visit Reston one day; see how miserable and disruptive those residents lives have become living close to a hospital.
And Lee- don’t try your nonsensical “Reston is urban” argument, its not- its a planned suburban community with a mixed used, clustered town center at its core. Very similar to how Ashburn will continue to grow as development along the Greenway continues.
it’sonlyhospital you are wrong there is no single family detached suburban style housing across the the street from the Reston Town center or the reston Hospital. The hosing near the reston hospital cam later and it is urban style housing one project is actually designed as Chicago style urban brownstones definitely city style housing that came after the reston Hospital not suburban style housing.
The broadlands site is across from almost million dollar suburban style housing that was there first. Even in the farms along the greenway the housing is single family and even though it is across the greenway it is very very close to the hospital and even the beatifully designed Clydes looks like a farm house. The zoning in Loudoun is horrific some of the worse in the country industrial popping up across from homes and on class A land that would be better suited for class A office with high paying jobs and taxes. Houston Texas has grown horribly even though they don’t have zoning it is an example of how we are going to look someday if we don’t rethink our zoning here.
It’sonlyahospitl and black out I would gladly give you a tour of the county and the hospital sites and give you the real real info in real life so you can visually see what I am talking about. I design for a living and many times over the years I have to figure out for an builder or developer how to screen our project off from the crap that is adjoining or might have an negative visual impact on our project. I did a lot of that especially in Houston and now Loudouns amateur planners are repeating those same mistakes here on an clean slate. Anyone want a tour I would more then be happy to do so rather then trying to explain it in the blogs and forums. When you are explained in real life by seeing it, you makes huge difference. That is why I would like to see massing models and and animated videos. We need experienced planners with proven track on tough problems in this county before the traffic and poor placement of buildings and developments hurt it even more.
Does anyone know the connection between Megan Descutner who is Director of Community and Government Relations for HCA and is in the HCA’s broadlands office to Scott York especially from the nineties. Well there has been a very close relationship here as his Campaign Director back then and I understand she was appointed to the county health board at that time. Please correct me if I am wrong. So how does york make and independent vote on this hospital issue. As well as other supervisors that are very close to staunch supporters of this hospital. We need an hospital and I don’t care who builds it just not on that site.
Lee-
Fair Oaks Hospital had $1,000,000 homes constructed RIGHT UP AGAINST THE FENCE of the hospital long AFTER the hospital was built. Unlike Broadlands where the homes are across a 4-lane divided highway with a 6 foot privacy fence. And the homes in Broadlands that are the most expensive and closest to the hospital where sold and built in the last two years. I know many of them are aware of the hospital and it did not bother them. Hmmm………
Nova Conservative-
I’ll take Reston over Loudoun or Fair Oaks any day. And myself and family members have used all three.
It’s common sense to me to put a hospital where the people are. Who is Rte 50 more convenient for? South Riding area, Middleburg, and Aldie. The last two are hardly booming population centers, and the South Riding/Stone Ridge area does not have the population base to support a hospital yet. Inova has stated that publicly at a BoS meeting that that area will not support a hospital for at least 10-15 more years.
The Ashburn area, over the last 10 years, has been the epicenter for growth in the county. If you don’t believe me, pull the records from the county and see where all the approved units have been. The vast, vast majority are within 3-4 miles of BRMC.
Would BRMC be more convenient to Purcellville than Lansdowne? Maybe, maybe not. But then there would be two hospital companies competing for their dollar. Would people in Purcellville and Hamilton tell you a hospital on Rte 50 would be more convenient than one on the Greenway? They’d really bust a gut over that!!
And ask some of the companies and businesses that Inova has fought and sued to keep out additional healthcare services if they think Inova is such a great and honorable company. They’ve done it in Purcellville, Ashhburn, and now trying to squeeze out an independent in Fairfax City (read yesterday’s Post story.)
Wow, what a lovely company. Their primary concern appears to be the almighty dollar, not the welfare of the residents of Loudoun County.
Your comment that Rte 50 has more infrastructure than the BRMC site is laughable beyond reason. Sorry. Let’s see….BRMC bounded by a highway and 2 4-lane divided highways. Rte 50, a single 4-lane road that is mired in traffic. That site would be as good as putting a hospital on Rte 7. Who would do that? Oh wait….there is one there. And I’ve seen the ambulances stuck in that traffic mess, with sirens and lights screaming, trying to fight through.
BRMC has lots of support within the community and they have done a lot due to resident concerns….like putting the emergency entrance on Belmont Ridge….like putting the 4-acre parcel closes to the homes for an HOA use and NOT building on it…..like putting additional landscaping off site on the HOA side of Broadlands Blvd. They also agreed to widen Belmont Ridge from Truro Parish to Brambleton, a $9,000,0000 road improvement.
I believe in free enterprise, and thus competition. Loudoun should be opening its arms to HCA instead of promoting a monopoly who continues to exercise its negative powers as demonstrated in the WPost article. However, I believe HCA should build its facility on the Rt. 50 rather than Broadlands. That way it can more easily serve Dulles South, Middleburg, Eastern Fauquier, and Northern Prince William.
Interesting tidbit on how Inova is using multiple tools to push its position. Last year I was donating blood at the drive in South Riding – the Inova bloodmobile was there. While the needle was in me, the Inova employee made it a point to lobby me against HCA coming to Loudoun! He parroted the party line that it would be bad for business and bad for Inova employees as well. I pushed back hard on the first point re: my comments above. On the bad for employees part, I asked him if he would rather have only one organization to sell his professional services or two? Wouldn’t it be better for him and his family to have two prospective employer bidding for his services rather than one? Didn’t he think that would result in him receiving better wages and benefits rather than him having to settle for whatever Inova felt they wanted to pay him? He conceded the point quickly and told me he only brought up the subject since he was instructed to do so by Management.
If find it distressing but not surprising that our local health care monopoly would tarnish the occasion of a blood drive with political lobbying. Our area is chronically short of blood which is a critical resource, monopoly or no monopoly. To inject political lobbying and risk alienating donors is heresy. I continue to regularly give blood through the Inova center in Centreville and local drives. However, one must assume other potential donors have stopped giving to avoid being lobbied.
Lets get real if you are an staunch HCA supporter you are going to find all kinds of crap about INOVA and visa versa. So their is mudslinging on both sides which then just neutralizes the arguments from both sides. All hospitals are regulated and most always give good care. Mistakes or poor judgment can happen at either hospital at times. I you are so worried about Health then try prevention and the best drug in the world called exercise.
No serious trauma is going to be treated at either hospital that victim is going to be life flighted to the trauma center in Fairfax.
I felt the post articles lame and have seen articles against HCA that are just as biased or even worse.
Cliff go over to the fairoaks hospital and over to those homes and you will see they left an mature visual buffer of trees and the hospital is not as tall as the proposed HCA. Further HCA is going to clear cut most of the site so their is no mature buffer. The reserve piece which they never talk about or bring up directly across from the homes will look nice at first. When they clear cut that piece some day and build maximum on that piece those people living across the street will scream and scream.
You all are conning them and you need to building the massing models and and animated video and show an model of maximum building and height on the reserve piece. ANd don’t start yopur con job that we don’t know what we are going to build there, if you don’t know then build a model of the maximum and maximum height allowed until you do know what you are going to build.
Cliff any day you want to walk the HCA site and look at the other hospitals I will be more then happy to take you on the tour.
If you are so sure that this hospital will have no major impact to the surrounding residential, then build the models and especially the animated video and prove it to us in 3d. Until then you are talking thru your hat.
You know what else? When another hospital is built around here, I WANT it to have a helipad. I don’t want it to be restricted in any way. Go ahead and build a big honking hospital, put the emergency entrance whereever its most convenient from a critical care standpoint, and operate helicopters all the time. That would at least maximize the use of the hospital. Otherwise, its just another Reston which can’t handle anything serious. (BTW–if your kid ever has anything go wrong that requires an ambulance ride, and you tell the EMTs you want to go Reston, they’ll laugh at you and keep driving right down to Fairfax.)
At least Loudoun has a Pedi-ER.
Obviously, HCA has had to make all kinds of concessions, such as the helipad, just to build the hospital–pretty much ensuring its just going to be another community hospital type of place. I want a REAL hospital in Loudoun. Again, I don’t care so much who builds it.
Cliff–wow, I don’t know you, but you are world class deceptive in terms of who the Rte. 50 location would serve. The issue is not whether its more convenient than Broadlands location for communities, its whether its more convenient than Loudoun. The Rte 50 site, of course, would be better than Broadlands for Brambleton, South Riding, Stone Ridge, Chantilly, Gainseville, and communities on the Rte. 50 corridor. But it would also be better than Landsdowne for Broadlands, too.
NovaConservative right on why build an hospital on an site that is going to have too many restrictions to become a full blown trauma venter eventually that is very short sighted in the big picture and in the long term.
Or realize it’s maximum potential for the best health care we can get.
Lee, perhaps you should run for planning czar since you know so much! I don’t even care about this debate any more – just tired of your pontifications…
When our current planners stop destroying the county with poor placement of developments that have an negative affect on the good neighboor developments and transportation I will shut up.
Further I speak as an very concerned resident that wants to county not only prosper economically but beautifully. The economic development brochure only shows pictures of the beautiful development here not the carp that has started popping up lately and before. Put the crap pictures of the crap development in the brochure and I will then shut up.
No I am not as good in planning as the professional planners that are innovative and have good solutions to tough problems. But I do know as most residents what looks good and what looks like crap.
Most of you moved into the beautiful PUDs here not next to crap that was not there when you moved in and built later.
85: I agree I want a helipad at the Broadlands hospital. Let’s join hands and ask them for it.
Tom, you are right on! I have an elderly friend who was at the Leesburg Inova facility. Apparently, every patient gets a little friendly hint about how the Leesburg facility is going to close if Broadlands Hospital is built.
Personally, I got the same message while getting a flu shot from one of their mobile buses. I played along, and the nurse said they are instructed to tell everyone that Broadland’s Hospital will cause Loudoun Hospital to close.
More bunk and fear-mongering.
Lee have you read the Washington Post article? You should really consider other sources of information than just Donna’s emails and mass mailings. You should let her speak for herself or at least verify what she is saying before cutting and pasting.
I could care less what Donna has to say and I have never met her. There are articles all over the place pro and con about the HCA and INOVA so that is an non issue for me as well as the care which is good at both. Blackout sorry bussy but you slant everything in favor for HCA as well as Cliff does. SO the pro con HCA and the pro con Inova cancels each other out.
The bigger issue is this the correct site for an Hospital. Does it have the property for expansion for it’s ultimate expansion to give the public the best health care without later going back to the board for more exemptions for proper expansion without infringing on it’s residential neighbors. They take the helipad out to please the neighborhood only to whine after they got their claws into the site that they want it back and on and on. Then there is the subject of the reserve land they don’t talk about which will have the greatest impact on the residential. It is one con job after another so HCA is no more truthful or truthful then INOVA. Give me a break.
Then there is Scott York who is up to his eyeballs in his connection to HCA in numerous articles showing his close connections my favorite is the minutes here where Megan Megan Descutner who is community Director of the BRMC for HCA and here is a quote from the minutes “”"”"Chairman York further moved that the Board of Supervisors approve the nomination of Megan Descutner of Sterling, Christine Stone of South Riding, and Robert Chirles, Director of Social Services, to serve on the Loudoun Mayors Healthcare Task Force. Seconded by Supervisor Towe.
Supervisor Burton applauded this effort and urged the group to keep in mind the real need in the rural area. He discussed the data that he and his wife had gathered regarding time traveled to area hospitals. He said that he would be glad to provide this data. “”"”" the complete link is here http://64.233.169.104/search?q=cache:8faWMjyeVG4J:inetdocs.loudoun.gov/archive/bosarch/docs/bosminutes_/businessmeeting_/2001minutes_/02052001/02052001.doc+Megan+Descutner+scott+york+loudoun&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=2&gl=us
It seems almost all the current BOS is up to it’s eyeballs in it’s connection to HCA from people that are extremely strong supporters that work or volunteer for our supervisors to direct connections to HCA as this last minutes shows York is and non of this comes out in the latest newspaper articles.
SO the HCA is a slam dunk to be approved from what I see. I just want to post so I have an record that this site is a bad bad spot for the hospital, and IF it proves to be a negative down the road for the residential such as property values those residents can look to Cliff, Blackout and Erica and the BOS that votes for it to blame.
All I say is build it on a site where it can properly expand for heliports and what ever and not con the public that they took out the heliport only to beg for it later and hiding or at the very least not talking about a large piece of reserve land directly across from almost million dollar homes and basically an con job on them to get their support without fully disclosing what they are going to use it for. Certainly HCA does not want to rock the boat until the get their approval claws into the site and just watch what happens. All of sudden their comes the potential for opening the door for the heliport and and potentially a massive building right across the homes on reserve lAND THEY DO NOT LIKE TO DISCUSS expect we don’t know what we want to do with it. Well at least tell the residents what the maximum building they could put there and I heard it could be as much as one hundred feet tall on the reserve land. Hey correct me if I am wrong so far nobody has. That site from what I understand is zoned for maximum height of 100 feet. THat is a long ways up there if it is directly across a home and no 6 foot fence or four land blvd is going to hide that.
Just build it on another site that takes solves these potential negatives that will loom on this site forever possibly.
Good grief Lee! Give it a rest !!!
You have made your point 800 times. I think we get it:
- HCA has proffered to never build on a reserve area. But you are convinced that they will build there anyways.
- HCA has proffered to not build a helipad. But you are convinced that they will build it anyways.
- HCA within a few hundred yards of residential = BAD
- Loudoun Hospital and Fair Oaks within a few hundred yards of residential = GOOD
- HCA must provide an animated video of the entire project (and this has been required of what other projects in Loudoun?)
- HCA political connections and participation in local health planning = EVIL
- INOVA political connections and participation in local health planning = GOOD
Does that pretty well sum things up?
Dan – LOL!
I was getting ready to respond – but I saw yours and it pretty much sums it up. THANK YOU!!!
NO Dan it does not sum it up when you give out incorrect information. See Dan your are giving out incorrect information that is why I have not given this a rest. I have seen the site plan and everyone should.
There is a reserve area by Clyde’s that will be given to the broadlands HOA do do what they want with it. There is another very large reserve area at the corner of Broadlands and belmont right across the residential HCA does not talk about that and it is on their site plan.
The helipad spot is still there although they don’t call it that anymore and I heard from an good source they will go for it once the intial plan is approved.
Again Loudoun hospital is not any where close to single family detached housing and the urban apartments which people have a choice to rent was built after the hospital.
Fair Oaks has an mature tall wide tree buffer and the hospital is not as tall as the proposed BRMC. Dan go drive it or I can take you on an tour.
Dan your facts as you state are not totally correct. ANd this is what bothers me does the public really understand what they are getting. Especially the existing residents closest to this hospital. I understand design and site palcement because I do it everyday as an designer, that has many times had to figure out how to screen off junk and bad neighbor developments and buildings from my clients sites. Now give correct information and I will let it go. I am going to fight as an resident of Loudoun to keep it beautiful and hopefully make residents aware of bad neighbor developments in the making as have been popping up all over lately.
I apologize to the moderators and others on this blog for my overindulgent posts. But there is so much misinformation and my quest to keep loudoun beautiful with good neighbor developments has made me want to correct the misinformation and expose some of the what is not being told. I am more then happy to give any of you a tour to see first hand what I am talking about. And if I am incorrect feel free to correct me, but I will not roll of if it is just correction that is only spin. I can prove what I am saying with site plans and plans of the proposed developments. Not rocket science
Lee-
The “reserve” that you are talking about being built and the homes near there? Guess what? They know about the hospital!!! Most of them are fine with it!!!!
The other property that will be for HOA use CANNOT be build on and I’ve already explained to you why, but you don’t want to listen.
Thaks for the offer, but I’ve been around the local hospitals many times, including a few times prowling around the Reston Hospital dumpsters because Donna assured me that’s where the pictures she was parading around were taken…….until it was pointed out they were actually take from INSIDE medical waste containers. I’m glad this is the person you seem to trust on face value.
I’ve also knocked on the doors of a few homes that border Fair Oaks…and there was no tree preserve. From their yard, we were staring at the hospital building.
Once again, you don’t really know what you’re talking about.
You need the tour and again more misinformation spinning it the way you want the public to see your tunnel vision.
Cliff qoute 1
“”The “reserve†that you are talking about being built and the homes near there? Guess what? They know about the hospital!!! Most of them are fine with it!!!!”"” Then show them what the maximum build out and height on that reserve piece in a massing model and then see what they say then Afraid to do it Cliff????? “”"”"
Cliff quote 2
“”"”" the other property that will be for HOA use CANNOT be build on and I’ve already explained to you why, but you don’t want to listen.”"”" I understand extremely well as I have told a zillion times so what is your point???
Cliff qoute 3
“”"”"Thaks for the offer, but I’ve been around the local hospitals many times, including a few times prowling around the Reston Hospital dumpsters because Donna assured me that’s where the pictures she was parading around were taken…….until it was pointed out they were actually take from INSIDE medical waste containers. I’m glad this is the person you seem to trust on face value.”"”"
More misinformation again from Cliff when Have I ever agreed with donna I don’t even know her and even said so in my above posts and said up there she is an non issue for what why I think the hospital should be built on another site.
Cliff qoute 4
I’ve also knocked on the doors of a few homes that border Fair Oaks…and there was no tree preserve. From their yard, we were staring at the hospital building.
Once again, you don’t really know what you’re talking about.”"”" Then you need the tour more then ever or need new eye ware. I will post pictures so your memory can be refreshed from those homes.
Cliff you are full of misinformation and spin. Walk your talk as we say in texas with pictures and massing models and animated videos. At least take the tour or perhaps you have given me the idea to not only post pictures but I will do an video myself of what I am talking about especially the homes adjoining the fair oaks hospital and the buffer.
You have the votes on this BOS to get this hospital approved, the more interesting thing is your very public comments about what HCA does not live up to their promises of no helipad or an massive building across the residential on the reserve piece and I repeat I am not talking about the HOA piece they are giving you all they are two separate tracts of land. SO stop confusing and spinning to the public.
I think there’s a difference between saying that there WILL be a helipad built and that there SHOULD be.
I think that the next hospital in Loudoun SHOULD have a helipad. I take BRMC at its word that there wouldn’t be…though frankly if there is, I hope the helicopters buzz Cliff’s house every night, he’d deserve it.
But lets build a real hospital out here, with all the trimmings. BRMC is a half assed hospital like Reston. Like I keep saying, I don’t really care WHO builds it (though this idea that big mean Inova is the only one who plays hardball is a joke), as long as its built in a location that makes sense.
And Broadlands doesn’t.
Lee-
You spin more than a merry-go-round.
Since you’re claiming that everything about the development of the site is hogwash…even though all the county zoning regulations support my point of view, why don’t you provide your “massing models” and “animated videos.” You’re the self-described all-knowing high powered developer insider, so I’m sure you have access to this stuff. I just tell airplanes were to go.
What is your argument to support your build out prediction? “Oh, well they can simply change all the zoning regulations to get what they want.” I don’t know if that’s naivete or ignorance speaking, but it’s all you have to cling to to support your arguments.
Stick to drawing pretty pictures. I can vouch that you do that very well.
I claim comment 100 for myself! It’s been a while since we broke the 100 comment barrier.
As we have all seen, zoning is often quite impermanent and relies often on the whims of the majority of the board. I do reject the arguments of some of the antis that this site is in the middle of a residential zone. That is bull – as pointed out many times it is surrounded on three sides by decidedly non-residential uses. The right on the Greenway location makes a lot of sense. INOVAs continuing fear mongering is worse than the ridiculous Hillary ad now playing with the poor little kids in bed wondering who is going to answer the White House hotline phone.
I like whoever started using bullet points the best, so I’ll follow suit on this point after opening the Sunday Extra and finding more Inova not-for-profit donations at waste:
– Inova staff is recruiting appellants to oppose the hospital in Broadlands (according to #9’s email from an Inova employee). Is it out of bounds to think they are also paying for that possible appeal or whatever, but pawning it off as “the people v. HCA” and how much might that be in attorney’s fees?
– There have been full-page negative ads in every local paper it seems and the Post extra – anyone know how much that costs (in terms of how many donors to the foundation have been hoodwinked into thinking their donations go to substantive programs and uses, or better yet “are re-invested back into the community” as they like to say)
- thats the last time I give to them.
Lee
#80- your pretty name for urban style brownstones is called a town home in my book; that’s suburban to me. We are not talking high density urban in Reston other than the few condo buildings at the RTC. Oh and by the way, they are building those brownstones in another suburban community; Brambleton right across the Town Center.
You always rail against VDOT, the Waxpool Task Force, and other agencies because they waste time in the planning process, and now you want HCA to build dollhouses and cartoons to show how it will look like? I’ll give you a quicker solution; go look at Reston Hospital and you will see.
FLEX SPACE RULES!!!
Hey you pro Hospital people for the BRMC what are you all so concerned about.
You have the votes to get it approved from the current BOS. Come on their are close ties to some BOS and HCA that go way back.
You got your hospital unfortunately a compromised one if the HCA really sticks to their concessions, and we will see if they really do. And a good many of the county residents will not be close to a hospital. And many residents will be very close to two hospitals. So this is not about building hospitals to serve and be close to as many residents as possible that are not near an hospital. It is about greed and greed on both sides. Not about giving as many residents as possible to be near an hospital. It is about a few residents to be close to two hospitals.
I am glad I don’t live across the street from this hospital and watch my home values fall because of it. It is a shame medical care is about special interest and not about the residents.
Lee, how about that Wash Post article, pretty revealing isn’t it?
That Washington Post article said all I needed to know. Somebody needs to stand up to Inova. That was some pretty damning evidence.
LI, you’ve no doubt seen the Youtube bastardization of that, right? The one where after the commercial ends, Hillary picks up the phone and it’s Monica, and she’s drunk and making a booty call for Bill?
Lee, whoever is advising you IS a member of the GOBN, and we all know what happens when they run up against “the POSSE”, now don’t we?
HCA is going to pay $3 MIL in taxes. They are confined by hard fixtures on three sides, so growth of the complex better go straight up. But as you’ve already seen on the plans, in a campus layout, that’s pretty hard to do.
HCA is coming. All you have to do now is accept that.
And you know what I heard, Lee? Scott York is going to be working for HCA!!!!!!!!
They are going to give him a quick tutorial on applying band-aids to patients.
I suppose that you oppose actual oil companies and electric companies meeting with the President to address energy concerns and alternative power ideas, huh? You know, since they’re the “experts” on those types of matters, it sure does look fishy.
10 Feet you got the votes for the hospital so what the hell is everyone worried about.
You know the BOS has been infiltrated by pro hospital people for this site so the votes are there.
I am just glad I don’t live across the street from it an d watch my property values drop because of it. And those poor people that live across the street may start screaming when they have 2 to 4 years of loud construction and trucks and heavy equipment coming and going all the time. What do we care non of us live near it??? Who cares what happens to those people.
Yep we need to have two hospitals very close together in this large county. It just wouldn’t make any sense to build the hospital closer to people that are not even close to an hospital now. Let them wait so people that already close to an hospital can now have a choice. Yep that is the thinking in loudoun no roads industrial up against homes. Blocked 30 to 50 million dollar interchanges that are only half useful again blocked by industrial. Building homes in totally industrial areas such as toll off 606 and industrial built on prime land destroying the potential of that land for class A developments. Yep you are right 10 feet you and the posse are doing a good job here in Loudoun. We will see in the near future how intelligent these decisions are. Looks like a lot a fuel for the next elections here. Oh did I mention one of our paid transportation folks in Loudoun believes the toll road and metro is going to take care of most of the traffic around our largest urban center to be built around Moorefield. Apparently parallel service roads along the greenway in that area is not important here in Loudoun like it is in other cities planned by innovative professional planners with proven track records solving the tough problems.. In Loudoun we have amateurs and the paid F Troop planning our county. ANd you wonder why we can not attract many high paying businesses if any at all here these days. hmmmm Yep get that hospital built in the wrong location destroy the property values of the near homes to get the last of the high paying jobs and tax dollars this county may see for a long long long time. And who cares that a few county residents get a choice of two hospital close by and leave a good chunk of the loudoun residents with no close by hospital care. Yep an county run by shortsighted amateurs and it is starting to look like like it is with misplaced developments and a almost non existent road system. I am going to sit back and watch until we can get real farsighted people and professionals planning the county then I will join in when I can work with real farsighted people that want to keep this county prosperous and beautiful like the puds many of you live in designed and built by the pros not the amateurs that are ruining many many sites and roads in this county forever. THat is when I will join in when we have people run this county intelligently and not shortsighted for immediate gain that will lead to more ruin. So my time will come it is not at this moment.
Lee,
Do you see the irony in your this statement of yours, “ANd you wonder why we can not attract many high paying businesses”.
Loudoun HAS attracted a high paying tax business. It’s called HCA. Now why in the world is our County making it so difficult for them to join our business community and contribute 3.5 million in revenue.
BTW, how about that Wash Post article, did you read it? Some really good stuff in their.
Well my good blackout hurry up and get the hospital built in the wrong location so a few residents can have double care and the many will have no close by care. Makes sense to me ha ha ha Hurry up my friend as that maybe all she wrote until the county gets some professional help in planning and developments and transportation.
You got the votes so just get the hospital built. I will wait maybe not so quietly back until the day comes and the pros come in to help this county and we can prosper and keep the county beautiful. Like I said my time will come to see how to correct and screen our past and present and near future mistakes.
The day will come as it always does when the right people come along and fix the place.
I can’t believe INOVA actually asks for donations as someone mentioned above. I am thoroughly disgusted that they are instructing all of their staff to pitch the whole INOVA vs. HCA case to all of their patients. Once again corporate greed seems to take precedence over everything else.
Can someone take the smiley-face option away from Lee J?
edmundburkenator,
I agree, but on the other hand, it does highlight Lee’s propensity to communicate emotions rather than facts.
I rest my case.
“The day will come as it always does when the right people come along and fix the place.”
LeeJ…THANKFULLY, that is what has just happened. A new BOS majority will now turn a huge wrongdoing around, and make it correct. They will add $3.5 MIL to the county tax reciepts in the process, and will effectively end the reign of INOVA’s special interest and greed.
This is a great day for Loudoun’s citizens.
10 feet a great day for a few citizens that will have double hospital care and many more will be far from hospital care. Also what are you saying we should double the hospital care in a small part of the county to punish another hospital. Perhaps the better solution is to replace 10 feets evil hospital and give many more close hospital care. Seems to be you have a personal vendetta not a concern for the many to have hospital care.
Let me illustrate the double standard for you.
Most out that way want the Executive building to be in the most populous area of the county…. but those same people do not endorse the same logic for a Hospital that will even the playing field on county healthcare?
I don’t want to punish INOVA. I want choices for Loudoun. The entry of BRMC raises the bar on healthcare in Loudoun county and benefits all her citizens.
If you try to paint this as a personal vendetta, you’ll be sucked into a real one, Lee. I will be more inclined to introduce the POSSE to the person who’s writing your script. I have no desire to do this, so I’m asking you to relax on that particular point, please. You do not want to face the POSSE on this, friend.
Sorry 10 feet I don’t scare easy as I am from Texas that had real Posse’s ha ha ha ha ha Or check with my lawyer brother first or the other ton of lawyers around me from relatives to friends. That is where you need to send your posse
Seriously it really does look like a vendetta or the pro HCA people wanting to punish inova. If inova is a problem then fix it and that does not mean by using another hospital to do it.
Close hospital care for the many NOT double hospital care for the few or to teach another hospital a lesson.
Further they want to build one executive building complex not two complexes near each other like the two hospitals for the few and no hospital for the many like the hospital wars are doing.
The latest:
HCA Virginia Dismisses Lawsuit Against
Loudoun’s Prior Board of Supervisors
Will Re-Apply for Zoning Permit to Build
Broadlands Regional Medical Center
Reston, VA, Wednesday, March 5, 2008 – HCA Virginia today announced that it will dismiss its legal claims against Loudoun County’s prior Board of Supervisors for denying the company’s zoning request for Broadlands Regional Medical Center (BRMC). That court case had been scheduled for trial beginning Monday, March 10, in Loudoun County Circuit Court.
In addition, the company announced plans to re-submit its zoning request to build the 164-bed hospital in Ashburn.
“This action gives the Board an opportunity to evaluate our application without pre-conditions or the pressure of looming litigation,†said Margaret Lewis, President of HCA’s Reston-based Capital Division. “We look forward to a fair and impartial review of our application. Our objective remains unchanged: to bring the county a hospital it supports and needs, and to improve healthcare access for all.â€Â
Wow, we finally have a Board of Supervisors who know how to negotiate with big business. I am impressed!
I am more impressed that the motive is for increased healthcare and options for our County.
Great job BOS! Now on to a civil debate about approving this project. Hold their feet to the fire about the proffered Belmont Ridge Rd improvements.
Completely different ball of wax this time around, eh? Man is this refreshing, or what?
They actually do something FOR the county INSTEAD of for their own pockets.
This is the way it’s supposed to work, people.
Concur on the proffers. After all they’ve been thru, don’t cheese out on the improvements and make it look bad.
and how many names are many of you posting under on all the different blogs to make it look like there is more support for the BRMC then maybe there is. You don’t fool me
Yeah… I see some crazy conspiracy theorist posting as lbuividas over at the Post.
ZING!
You know perhaps I don’t belong here. I showed up and really believed we needed a change in Loudoun Government. Maybe the pendulum now has moved too far in the other direction from what I read here lately. I am very independent in my thinking so perhaps this club here is not for me.
Lee J, don’t start pressing the pouty-face button now. I think you bring a good perspective and would hate to see you go because you got some static on the hospital issue.
You are correct Ed I just had a very rare weak moment.
I am back in action”"”" Hospital care for the many NOT double hospital care for the few”"”". 
Lee…the one thing you do not want to start accusing us of is multiple posters on one computer. It is the VERY mistake Munsey, Smith and Myers made last election. We’re very real, we are very numbered, and we don’t need to stack aliases to win.
“Those who forget the lessons of (recent Loudoun)history, are doomed to repeat them.”
10 feet you know the real truth and you will have to live with it.
I will add it is funny how you all welcomed me when I went to bat for Miller and agreed with you all. Now that on one subject I take an entirely diferent position and you all, all of sudden don’t want me around. What do you all think about the vice chairman Susan Klimek Buckley’s strong stance against the vote last week at the BOS her credentials as an lawyer look pretty impressive especially her job with fairfax county. Perhaps because of that job she has a lot more insight in what will happen because the BOS decided to stop the BRMC lawsuit and the vote to move forward with a whole new look at this.
Chill out, Lee! You’re welcome here – don’t take everything Munsey says as the gospel truth, even though she puts it across that way. You do tend to ramble on a bit, which can set people off at times, but you are certainly welcome to state your case and defend it.
As I have said, I don’t have any vested interest in either HCA or INOVA, I simply believe that competition is good and we need more businesses in this county. Anything the last board did deserves scrutiny, and anything this board does deserves scrutiny – I just have a very informed opinion that many of the actions of the last board were ethically and morally challenged.
Lee, I’m with LI on this one, and if you read all the threads here for months back… sometimes LI and I have not always agreed.
What did you mean about me having to live with the truth? I do fine with the truth. The identities you witness here are all individuals.
Munsey and Smith made that allegation here years ago, and in the end, we found NUMEROUS identities for both of them over a plethora of forums. Kinda like they believed if they did it, we also did it.
I believe they do this because if it were known to be them posting, the subject about which they speak instantly goes in the dumpster. Normal people dislike them that much.
Are we done here now that LI opened up a new hospital thread???? I hope so