Wow. This School Board continues to demonstrate a political tone deafness not seen in these parts since the 2003-2007 term of the Board of Supervisors. They continue to foster policies that threaten to drive public expenditures and taxes through the roof in future years, and ignore real problems in need of attention. They are dismissive of concerned citizens and are engaged in a smear campaign against them. They forget who they work for – US, not their connected friends in high places, or their employees (well, the last BOS never let staff control them, I’ll give them that). But as the failed Dulles South CPAM failed in the face of an ouraged citizenry, so do does this proposal seem destined to fail, regardless of what the powers that be wants.
This School Board is expending what little political capital they have left in trying to ram this Wheatland contract through. All while pressing needs go unaddressed and huge staffing problems are revealed. As to the first, there are huge problems in attendence boundaires in the Ashburn-Dulles areas, which they have yet to resolve. Their last meeting on this was an exercise in futility and a true embarrassment from a group of public officials. Read some of the lowlights here. Marshall and Reed voted against their own plan, and DuPree made a series of insulting clueless comments, further elaborated on in 151 comments here at John Stevens’ blog. While the proverbial Rome burns, they fiddle endlessly with this site selection for schools that will not be needed for years and years. John Stevens has turned over his blog to Jennifer Bergel to prattle endlessly about the Wheatland deal (the last seven posts dedicated to this). Bergel has bought into this 100% and will go down with the ship. And all of this is happening while it is revealed that LCPS hired a teacher who KILLED a student in Texas! Maybe Hatrick should spend a little more time reviewing hiring practices instead of jetting around the world for a full one quarter of the work year.
This School Board needs to get it’s priorities in order and focus on the very pressing needs of today’s students. Sure, it’s good to plan ahead, but not in the bumbling dismissive way they have handled this Wheatland matter. To those who complain about my indignant reaction to their bumbling, I say tough cookies. They deserve eveything they get – they are supposed to work for us and be wise stewards of our tax dollars. This deal flies in the face of those simple truths, and would be bad enough if it were a singular example, but unfortunately it is just another chapter in a long horrifying comedy of errors. Enough is enough. If it takes getting supremely pissed off to effect change, that’s what will happen. it worked with that last rude dismissive Board, and it will happen again with this one. That’s no threat, it’s a promise born of frustration and disgust.
![[Post to Twitter]](http://www.tooconservative.com/wp-content/plugins/tweet-this/icons/tt-twitter.png){kind=icon}
May 21st by Loudoun Insider
If LCPS had just googled the teacher’s name that was involved in the death of a TX student they would not be embarrassed right now. Of course everything is going to come back clean and legit, bad teachers are protected by the unions, and they get passed from school to school, district to district and no one is the wiser.
This teacher was in the news in TX, she would have popped up on a google search.
I guess Hatrick and his minions were too busy planning his next trip abroad and defending the Wheatland deal to the bitter end.
LI, you should run for School Board. Someone needs to clean out these augean stables.
Brian I think LI should run for Commonwealh’s Attorney!
I am no attorney, so CA is out for me. Since the AG race is getting so much attention, I do like the idea of expanding the AG’s power to investigate politically charged cases. The Commonwelath’s Attorneys are usually too well connected locally to have the stomach to pursue these cases. We’ve seen much of that bias here in Loudoun.
I have no interest in running for School Board, but there must be better options in this well educated county than the current crop. If anyone knows of good potential candidates, please encourage them to run.
The smear campaign seems focused on the April 29 meeting where officals explicitly restricted what the questions the public were “allowed” to ask. Of course that attitude ranckled folks right out of the gate. Anyone who felt intimidated that night were either public officials or anyone empathetic for those officials. The reason members of the audience became frustrated was when responses blatantly dodged the question or surprising new information was shared, (i.e., Cangiano initially asked for $15M but LCPS successfully negotiated that down to $9+M!).
If anyone who was not there sincerely wants to know exactly what happened enough to pay a reputable vendor to make a copy of it, I’m happy to provide my recording. I guess if I had asked for permission before setting up the camera on the sidewall of the cafeteria that night, we wouldn’t have had any record of what REALLY happened that night because yesterday LCPS PIO Wayde Byard said, “We are currently trying to enhance the audio on our tapes of the 29th meeting. If they can be suitably enhanced, we will post them on our Web site. We do not anticipate creating a written transcript. ”
Officials clearly stated at the beginning of the Apr29 meeting that a transcript would be made. It seems all too convenient now for this smear campaign against informed citizens to be waged while the only official record of the meeting will not likely be made available after all.
They absoutely promised a transcript. Yet another outright lie/broken promise from our public “servants”. And some accuse me of that same thing. And LCPS and their followers wonder why some people are mightily ticked off about this whole episode?
Great post at the By Neddie Jingo blog (I haven’t been to this site in some time -some really good stuff there!) on the historic building issue:
http://byneddiejingo.blogspot.com/2009/05/what-do-you-save.html
I can just imagine how they will “enhance the audio”. They’re probably adding in riot sound effects to show just how unruly those protesters were.
The School Board’s own appraisal says that Cangiano only paid $35,000/acre (including all the improvements.) So where does the $47,500 figure come from? He is still being paid $12,500 per acre more than he paid for it in 2007? And when he had contracted to buy it, apparently he thought the property had a vested A-3 subdivision, but the County challenged the vesting of that plat, so he got fewer lots– HE OVERPAID FOR THE PROPERTY because he thought he had an A-3 vested subdivision… AND, prices have dropped 30-40 percent since then…
Also, the appraisal for the brick home and several parcels is online at the School Board site, and it is clear that they appraised this property as if the preliminary plat had been recorded into final finished lots, because he does cite some sales for 3 acre lots, etc, to justify the appraisal (which is way on the high side even if the lots had been recorded.)
The preliminary plat for this part of the property under contract also shows a road that needs to be built, and an AR-1 cluster, with wells that still need to be drilled and septic sites still needed to be located. There were two rural economy lots, 15 acres each, that he appraised for $700,000 each–ridiculous price! and he appraised 1 acre lots for nearly $200,000–one acre lots with no road designed or built yet… when 3 acre lots are selling at auction for closer to $100,000– and some 1 acre lots have been on the market in Hamilton for several years at $115, 000 and not sold yet…
The appraisal is a total joke, and if they are going to attack people for pointing that out, then so be it…
how is it possible that these “professional” negotiators obtained only ONE appraisal for a purchase of this size?
how’s that for watching over the public purse?
The appraisal notes that when Cangiano bought the property he thought he had a vested A-3 prelim plat (with more lots than he ended up with when he had to re-do it with the AR-1 cluster.)
So, he overpaid for the property, and that overpayment is factored into the “cost per acre.”
The appraiser noted there was no way to separate out the various costs of improvements on the 550 acre property, so he just averaged the sale price that Cangiano bought the property for to arrive at the $35,000 per acre cost per acre.
What is deceptive about this is:
the cost per acre included all the improvements.
Anyone familiar with the property knows there are some pretty expensive improvements on the bulk of the property that Cangiano will retain… so the cost per acre is totally inflated..
And now he agrees to reduce the price to $47,500 per acre — somehow claiming that this is his “cost” — when really it is $12,500 more than the cost he paid, according to their bogus way of calculating cost… his real cost for the land was much less than $35,000/acre– and as I said, he thought he had a vested A-3 preliminary subdivision plat, and he did not.
Why would it matter what Cangiano paid for the property? Why would an appraiser take that into consideration?
When my house was appraised, it didn’t matter what the previous owner had paid, or overpaid, for the house. Only current fair market value was considered.
Good question, Lville Lady.
The appraisal that was posted on the School Board website — the one that seemed to indicate Cangiano bought the property with an A-3 vested preliminary plat– is not posted on the website any more. None of the several appraisals of the different large parcels that make up this property are posted any more. Or at least I can’t find them…. is the story of the reduced price also gone?
The appraisal (indicating the A-3 stuff) was posted with other documents on a page about the April meeting in Lville…
Consider the difference in number of lots under A-3 zoning and AR-1 cluster zoning:
A perfect A3 situation (few exist but this is about as perfect as they come, very good soils, road frontage and topography) would give you 53 lots for 160 acres; the AR-1 cluster preliminary plat supposedly showed 36 lots….17 fewer lots…..
17 FEWER LOTS!
So he bought the property based on A-3 and a supposedly vested plat (that the County refused to vest) and he got something like 17 fewer lots for just this 160 acres —
Seems to indicate he overpaid for the property…
And we are paying him even more than he paid IN 2007? The appraisal that is still up on Sarah’s website shows the appraisal attributed a $34,600 per acre cost. Now they say $47,500 was his “cost” It is so screwy, it makes you wonder…WHY?
And at least one of the appraisals of one of the assemblage (that was taken down) notes that the appraiser used finished lots to appraise preliminary lots, where no roads had been designed or built, wells were still necessary to drill, septic sites to find… and the “comps” that he used were not good comps, for other reasons.
The result: extravagantly appraised lots that were only proposed lots on paper only…the School Board needs a revised appraisal, on this basis alone.
Can anyone else find the appraisals that used to be on the website?
Sally,
Great catch on the subdivision.
I think everything is still up on the lcps website (I see the various Cangian appraisals there).
http://cmsweb1.loudoun.k12.va.us/509905169119/site/default.asp
“I have no interest in running for School Board, but there must be better options in this well educated county than the current crop.”
Now I am certainly no SB apologist BUT this is the hardest job out there (public service-wise) and there is absolutely no fiscal compensation to speak of associated with it. In the end the (with few exceptions) you end up with really incompetent people or politicians wishing to use the position as a stepping stone (ala Andrews). There are people who do a good job on this board (Warren Geurin is one of them and represents his district well) but unless the system changes, we will always end up with weak characters in one of the most important positions in the county.
I say quadruple the pay of the SB – it still will be woefully inadequate compensation for the effort expended to do the job correctly, but you will at least attract moderately competent applicants for the job.
I have to say I agree with increasing SB pay – not as much as BOS, but close. We absolutely must find better quality candidates to manage a full three quarters of our tax dollars expended each year.
Both boards are pretty close to full time jobs. The hours can be brutal. Trying to do this and maintain a full time job is tough.
No one gets elected to either position to get rich. However, the pay has to be enough to allow regular folks into the process.
The appraisal still galls me.
Now I realize, there is NO approved preliminary plat for the AR-1 cluster. All he had was an A-3 plat that the County refused to vest, and a sketch of a possible AR-1 cluster, if he were to drill more wells and find more septic sites. (He could not use all of his previous septic sites or wells because the cluster provision makes him put the lots closer together.)
So, the appraisal is based on finished lots with roads built, and wells drilled, etc. when all that really exists is a sketch of what he might be able to submit to ask for approval.
You cannot even SUBMIT a preliminary plat without having health dept approval for all of you septic sites and wells drilled and designated for at least half of your lots and a hydrogeo (or else you have to drill all your wells.) He was going to have to find more septic sites? May not have been possible since the proposed lots are so small and close together. And drill more wells, more expense…and would they have yielded enough water to be approved?
The appraisal was a total joke.
At a minimum, the contract should be cancelled to do a real appraisal. At least the other 200 acre comparable with 38 lots for sale for 3.4 million had a real approved preliminary plat.
Since the public well set back to the creek waiver was denied, and they want to use some off site well, seems like they have a water reason to cancel, too.
The School Board needs to exercise its fiduciary responsibility to the taxpayer and cancel this contract and demand a better appraisal–at a minimum.
So who do we hear is still in favor of this terrible deal? supposedly Ms. Bergel and Ms. Godfrey? Mr. Reed? Mr. Dupre? yes, but why?
Do they know nothing about land development or appraisals and can’t they see all the ridiculous “errors” or worse which grossly inflated the appraisal of this property?
You would think since property has been identified in Lovettsville that might work, they would cancel this, and look around to see if the Plan could be accommodated–work with some of the more involved citizens. The Cangiano property is not going anywhere any time soon.
Cancel the Cangiano contract for water reasons alone–the well waiver has been denied by the County, and why are they testing an offsite well?
Paying the SB more money would only result in more of our tax dollars down the drain. The majority would still be flunkies and the game would remain the same – use scare tactics to squeeze as much money out of taxpayers as possible, regardless if it is really needed or not.
The SB is only the problem in that they refuse to get rid of the real problem – Hatrick. The county leadership needs a major shake up. All the career politicians and bureaucrats who have been around since Loudoun was podunk need to go. Kirby Bowers departure was a good start!
Hatrick absolutely must go, and Adamo can follow him out the door. Adamo has been a miserable failure in procuring good sites for value. Of course the current School Board is supplicant to Hatrick, instead of how it should be – the other way around. Hatrick has been there far too long.
One of the primary discerning issues for candidates in the next SB elections must be – will you vote to terminate Hatrick’s contract and send him to retirement?
However, the pay has to be enough to allow regular folks into the process.
- G. Stone
I agree, if both parties want to attract good, qualified candidates then the pay must be commiserate with the hours. Right now it seems like the BOS or SB is the perfect job for retired folks or individuals that have a spouse that is very well-paid. It is 2 full-time jobs for the rest of us.
Supposedly Stevens, Ohneiser and Guzman are advocating for canceling this contract, but Guerin and Marshall, although supportive of canceling, are wavering.
And Bergel, Godfrey and Reed still supporting going forward??? What is wrong with them? They need a math refresher class to see how overpriced this deal is based on a 2007 cost and A-3 plat the county refused to vest? and an appraisal that assumed finished lots, when the AR-1 cluster proposal that was never even submitted, and would need to find more septic sites and drill more wells and do more preliminary engineering before the county would even accept a prelim plat application…
All of them, but especially, our at large representative, Tom Reed need to get on the side of the taxpayer, and the citizens.
Dupre is a lost cause I guess, too entrenched with his developer buddies…
#15, thanks Hillsboro. The 2007 appraisal says septic sites need to be found, wells drilled. So no prelim plat for that original appraisal.
The property was reappraised in 2008, and here the appraiser says plans have been submitted to the County and are expected to be approved soon. So, maybe they do have an approved preliminary plat.
I asked Mr. Burton to check on this, but even if they do have an approved prelim plat, the appraisal used three acre finished lot sales to justify valuing lots merely proposed on paper and no where near finished…
And we have a good comp in the 200 acre property nearby for sale for 3.4 million with 38 lots approved preliminarily.
sally, you made a very important observation on Robert Dupree being a “lost cause … too entrenched with his developer buddies.” It’s a polite and subtle point. Maybe it’s semantics, but let’s reconsider. I offer that he’s not lost at all. He knows exectly what he’s doing. Cold and calculated. Somebody(s) benefits from his tenure on the SB. Unfortunately it’s neither the taxpayers nor the school children. In this case “entrenchment with” most likely mean “on the payroll of.”
The likes of Dupree et al. are a public interest disease! You don’t see the ill effects at first. Afterall it’s for a good cause … our children. But as time goes on the chronic and painful signs appear. A CIP in the B$ range goes well beyond lunch money. It’s big business. In this SB generated big business era, the County currently has no means to identify any potential improprieties. What may be even worse is that their scam is likely perfectly legal.
I agree whole heartedly with LI. They gotta go. And we all know they won’t go easily. Robert in particular. He’s a rainmaker for himself and his benefactors. He consistently takes the approach that no land is too expensive … no new school is too many. It will continue until the voters (or even sooner) the BOS simply say ‘no mas!’
If this School board hired Hatrick, and/or has always supported him, how does firing him help? Won’t the board simply hire someone else just like him? If they support his philosophies, the next guy/gal will simply be Hatrick, Part Deux.
Loudoun county school board seems to be frighteningly similar to Fairfax board where the majority are democrats (10-2) and every democrat on the board works for the Superintendent, Jack Dale, and his huge staff. They support everything that Dale and his staff propose. It’s been that way since Fairfax foolishly opted for elect school boards back in 1992. Every few years people call for the ousting of the current superintendent. A new super is hired, and the Merry-go-Round continues to roll. A different guy, with a different personality, but the same philosophies and the same ol’ school board support for staff, and their latest goofy ideas, over support of students. Staff wants over students’ needs, every, single, time. They couldn’t care less what parents, or taxpayers, want for their schools and their children. What staff wants ALWAYS outweighs students, parents, and taxpayers. School board works for staff. ALWAYS.
Sad to see the same things happening here in Loudoun. I had hoped for better.
I guess what bugs me is we are supposed to praise them when they got the price reduced to 9 million for 170 acres…
When 200 acres with 38 preliminarily approved lots has been for sale for a while at 3.4 million, very close by…
The Cangiano property does not have the same engineering status, or as much land, but we are still paying almost 3 times the price of this other property–that no one is buying..
One reason no one is buying properties like this, with preliminary plats is because to retain the value you would have to pursue the preliminary plat– you only have a certain amount of time to pursue a preliminary plat before it lapses and then you have nothing.
You need diligently pursue the final plat, which means you need to engineer and build the roads, and no one is interested in doing that these days–there is no market for these kinds of projects…
So why should we have to pay?
Because that’s what Hatrick and DuPree want, Sally! The ruling junta says they must have Cangiano’s property, at any cost. Just like they had to have Greenvest’s Lenah property. It’s plain old ridiculous.
RE: #20
It definitely seems like Bergel is determined for a Cangiano/Burgess contract to go forward. I’ve tried several times to c&p her latest email but it won’t post for some reason. Anyway, she lists the recent changes to the contract and then she says “Even with these changes, and more, which I will identify, there is a call to “kill the contract” at Tuesday’s school board meeting.
Though I hear this call loud and clear, I do not think it is the right thing to do.”
After all the buzz this week I was hopeful that the contract would be canceled at the SB meeting this coming Tuesday. Now I think that it will indeed be canceled and then immediately rewritten at the ***NEW LOWER PRICE*** (@@ <—that’s an eyeroll) with a longer testing window. Never mind about all the improprieties that have surfaced in this process so far, we the taxpayers are just supposed to ignore that because the School Board knows best. UGH!!!
Just heard a good quote, “Credibility is the currency of leadership.”
How can we trust the School Board if they do not cancel this contract? no credibility and no leadership….
new article, BoS may vote down Cangiano next week if SB does not…
http://loudounextra.washingtonpost.com/news/2009/may/23/board-might-vote-soon-3-school-campus/
Well I guess they can have Cangiano’s current and former attorneys work something out on that new contract! What a cozy bunch they are at Loudoun public schools. Dupree can’t let this die – these land deals are the only way he feels important.