UPDATE:
A worthwhile blog to read on why pointing the finger at the Governor doesn’t work.
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Nov 30th by Too Conservative
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Clearly there is some nuance to Huckabee’s action in commuting the sentence Clemmons received as a sixteen year old. And it would be completely unfair to say that the deaths of the four police officers in Washington are Mike Huckabee’s fault. Having said that, his future presidential ambitions are toast. Republican primary voters don’t do nuance. They like thirty second sound bites and bumper sticker slogans.
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This is Huckabee’s Willie Horton moment. End of story.
Dan
on December 1st, 2009Huckabee is a good man, albeit way too right wing for LM. The Dems are going to milk this incident for all it’s worth and Mike’s political aspirations are dead. That being said, we need to be thinking about a moderate or right-leaning candidate who can win a Rep. primary and kick a$$ in 2012. More and more I see Obama as a one-term president. Hope springs eternal. Mitt’s my guy.
Loudoun Moderate
on December 1st, 2009A moderate candidate like, say John McCain?? Pu-lease. Been there, done that, lost our shirts, no thanks. Mitt is probably not the man, his MA healthcare plan did him in.
I don’t know what this means for Mike Huckabee, unfortunately it will be miscontrued and used by just about everyone from this blog to the libs in the oval office. The judge that allowed this killer out on 15,000$ bail, after an established career in crime, is the culprit.
Loudoun Lady
on December 1st, 2009I agree that Huckabee’s political ambitions are “toast” now. His political demise may prompt more Palin followers to suggest that she be the nominee. And though I have mixed feelings about her, running against a woman is hard. It will be especially hard to run against a pretty woman with children who has developed her narrative. When Geo. Allen ran against Mary Sue Terry (& whipped her soundly), I remember one of his higher-ups commenting “it is really tough to campaign against a woman”.
kelley in virginia
on December 1st, 2009Loudoun Moderate, I hardly think Democrats are the ones who will be pillorying Huckabee over this. It is his potential Republican primary opponents who will be beating him over the head with this. They will call him “soft on crime” and it will hurt him. It doesn’t matter that the charge is not supported by the facts.
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Facts have never played too prominent a role in Republican presidential politics. I recall the “facts” that were spread about John McCain in the 2000 South Carolina primary as being pivotal to W. winning the nomination that year. The “fact” that McCain had fathered an illegitimate black child and the “fact” that McCain was mentally unstable because of his time at the Hanoi Hilton (deeply ironic that the candidate whose campaign spread this avoided active service in Viet Nam). Do you think the reality and complexity of clemency decisions Huckabee made as governor will get a thoughtful hearing in such an environment?
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Good luck with your wish for a moderate conservative candidate in 2012. With a primary electorate that is smaller and farther right it isn’t likely to happen. My money is on Palin.
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The Executive Committee of the North Carolina GOP did give you some good news the other day. They voted to continue the practice of allowing unaffiliated voters to vote in Republican primaries. The extremists had wanted to close future GOP primaries to insure only far right nominees. Evidently the Executive Committee didn’t see the wisdom of shrinking the party into irrelevance. They seem to want to win elections with the votes of middle of the road voters.
Dan
on December 1st, 2009The Huck should stick with his Fox show — terrible decision.
Michael
on December 1st, 2009Kelley, I think you are right about running against a woman. I think it is more than simply having to worry that how you frame an attack may be seen as sexist though. I think there may be an inherent advantage at this point for a female candidate. I believe there are a number of women who — all other factors being roughly equal — will consider gender as a tie breaker. And I think this number is greater than the number of men who are reluctant to vote for a woman (most of those dinosaurs have died off). It isn’t a huge edge. But I think it is real.
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The interesting thing about Palin is that she doesn’t poll nearly as well among women as men. By a significant spread.
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I think that demonstrates the miscalculation McCain made with the Hail Mary pass he threw by choosing her. Clearly he was aiming for disaffected Hillary supporters. And had he chosen a qualified woman he may have gotten some of them. At least if my notion about gender being a tie breaker when other factors are equal holds. But other factors were clearly not equal.
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Do you really think Palin is the most likely beneficiary of Huckabee not being a viable candidate in 2012? I can certainly see that in Iowa where evangelical Christians are such a high proportion of the Republican electorate. But not so much in New Hampshire.
Dan
on December 1st, 2009Running against a woman and running against Palin are 2 different animals. Has no one followed how this woman was treated in the last election? No rules apply to Palin. Whether or not she benefits from Huckabee’s situation remains to be seen. 2012 is a long way off a making predictions now is strange.
Loudoun Lady
on December 1st, 2009Mitch Daniels, please.
Cato the Elder
on December 1st, 2009Cato, better wait for the Tim Durham thing to wash out before jumping on the Mitch Daniels band wagon. It probably won’t hurt him, but it isn’t good for a fiscal conservative to have a chief fundraiser who is a crook.
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The nekkid girls making out at the parties won’t be helpful with the social conservatives either. Then again, after Vitter and Ensign got a free pass, maybe the social conservatives don’t care about that stuff anyway.
Dan
on December 1st, 2009All kidding aside, Daniels is an interesting dark horse. A long shot. But not at all inconceivable.
Dan
on December 1st, 2009Clemmons isn’t Huckabee’s only problem. Look up Wayne DuMond as well. Huckabee has a troubling history of pardoning criminals or commuting their sentences only to see them become repeat offenders. I think he is a good man who has a good heart and perhaps he gives some people too much credit, thinking that they have or can change.
Romney’s biggest problem will be his MA health care debacle. Romney’s second biggest problem will be his use of liberal class warfare rhetoric that he uses to attack the flat tax to this very day.
Think:
Haley Barbour
Mike Pence
Bobby Jindal
Sarah Palin
Tim Pawlenty
John Thune
Bob Riley
Riley
on December 1st, 2009Right wing radio has been clobbering Huckabee over this. They have never liked him because he doesn’t kiss their asses and now they smell blood so don’t look for too much in depth analysis of what actually occurred.
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Some folks are saying that it became widely known in Arkansas that if a prisoner used the Jesus dodge that Huckabee, being a minister himself, would fall for it. Understandable, but hardly what you are looking for in sound executive decision making.
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It is not uncommon in other areas of life as well. It is hard for many believers to believe that others who present themselves as believers are con men scamming them. Thus we see some of the biggest crooks with little fish printed on their business cards. And many see that little fish and abandon any further due diligence. When they tell you they are good Christian businessmen you would be well advised to hold your wallet tightly. And perhaps religious “conversions” should NEVER be considered as a factor when making parole or commutation decisions.
Dan
on December 1st, 2009I’m surprised no one has mentioned Bob McDonnell, who combines Huckabee’s appeal with the Religious Right with Romney’s slickness. I’d think he’d look like a very attractive candidate to Republicans. Certainly more attractive than Jindal or Palin, both of whom would obviously be in over their heads.
Steve Vaughan
on December 1st, 2009Riley, I believe you have misidentified Romney’s biggest problem in securing the Republican nomination. His biggest problem, just as it was in 2008, is his Mormon faith. Religious bigotry toward Mormons among a significant slice of the Republican primary electorate is the mountain he has to climb.
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You wouldn’t think that would be the case in the 21st century. You would have thought Jack Kennedy’s election in 1960 would have put the whole “strange and alien” religion thing in the rear view mirror. But it is still very much with us.
Dan
on December 1st, 2009Steve, as a practical matter, McDonnell would have to begin running for president about one year into his term as governor. Admittedly the Republican field isn’t terribly strong, but one year in it is hard to see him mounting a credible campaign.
Dan
on December 1st, 2009@Steve Vaughan, I can’t wait until Bob starts implementing his plan for Virginia, outlined in his thesis. The thought of it makes me want to party like it’s 1799!
200 Grande
on December 1st, 2009Jim Huntsman please. It won’t happen though… too many LLs in the party, not enough LMs.
Edmundburkenator
on December 1st, 2009Yeah, Edmund, we have had so much success with your candidates. No thanks.
Loudoun Lady
on December 1st, 2009Huntsman would be an interesting pick as well. Being fluent in Mandarin will be quite an important skill for the forseeable future.
Cato the Elder
on December 1st, 2009“The nekkid girls making out at the parties won’t be helpful with the social conservatives”
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Seriously? I had not heard about this one. If true, his stock just went up with me. Generally speaking, we’re OK with gay sex as long as it’s two hot lesbians.
Cato the Elder
on December 1st, 2009200 Grande:
That’s what makes him a credible GOP candidate to me. Unlike Romney, who’s a RINO trying to pass, McD still has those belief hie outlined in his thesis. Unlike Palin or Jindal or Huckabee he can credibly pretend not to. That’s a winning combination. His biggest drawback in running for president would be, as Dan said, that Virginians don’t like it when their governor decides to do somethng else with his time. Also, he’s really, really short. It’s been a long time since we elected a president as tiny as McDonnell.
Steve Vaughan
on December 1st, 2009Cato, in fairness to Daniels, the party was at Durham’s house and there is, as far as I know, no evidence that Daniels attended. If simply being associated with rich people with questionable morals was a disqualification to public office we would need to hold one whale of a lot of special elections to fill all the vacant seats.
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I bet you have one of those t-shirts that says you support gay marriage, but only if both chicks are hot.
Dan
on December 1st, 2009LL, I thought Palin was YOUR pick.
Edmundburkenator
on December 1st, 2009That is the one thing Loudoun Lady and I completely agree on. We both want Palin to be the 2012 nominee. It will be the greatest campaign since Pat Paulsen in 1968.
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Of course, Paulsen was playing it for intentional laughs.
Dan
on December 1st, 2009I’ve never met McD personally. How tall is he?
kelley in virginia
on December 1st, 2009“I bet you have one of those t-shirts that says you support gay marriage, but only if both chicks are hot.”
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Indeed. I also have one that says “I support single moms” that I wear on trips down to the Camelot.
Cato the Elder
on December 1st, 2009Kelley: At a guess, 5′7″. I’m 5′10″ and he’s considerably shorter than I am.
Steve Vaughan
on December 1st, 2009Edmund, I’ve never said Palin was my pick. I do love how she makes the left’s teeth itch, so scratch away. You too Danny boy.
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Bob McDonnell is probably 5′10, I am 5′9 and was wearing heels when I met him, I was an inch or so taller. The second time I met him I was wearing flats and he was a little taller than me. I have a picture with him and my estimates are based on that too. Not sure where you were standing when you met McDonnell Steve, but maybe you on a step?
Loudoun Lady
on December 1st, 2009There are a lot more direct blame between these killings and Mike Huckabee. But it stands to question why Huckabee was so frequent in his use of pardons, does he let his religious compassion get in the way of the greater responsibility he holds as executive in charge of the security of the entire population. I question whether Huckabee allows his better angels to sing too loud sometimes, whether he’s capable of making a decision that is best for the entire community against individual sad stories that might move us. When your in a position both as governor or later as president, you need to be able to separate your bleeding heart for upholding the system your in charge of despite the please.
Chris
on December 1st, 2009LL,
I’ve know McDonnell for about 15 years, covered him in the GA. He’s nowhere near 5′10″. Maybe he was wearing lifts on the campaign trail?
Steve Vaughan
on December 1st, 2009Hear me now and believe me later – Mr. Steve Vaughan is correct. I personally took a tape measure to Bob McDonell at a pre-election rally, and he is exactly 5′8″ and one half inches in stature – not that there is anything wrong with this. I believe that his height may flux by as much as 1.5 inches, based on what his hair is doing on any given day. Loudoun Lady – thank you for sharing your height in heels and in flats. How tall are you in stilettos?
Ravi Oli
on December 1st, 2009Ravi, Depends on the stilletos. I always carry a tape measure around to measure candidates.
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Maybe Bob was wearing lifts? Who knows, but unless I shrunk approx 2 inches the man is taller than me. He stands very straight too, nice posture.
Loudoun Lady
on December 1st, 2009“Edmund, I’ve never said Palin was my pick.”
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Remember, the internet is search-able.
Edmundburkenator
on December 1st, 2009Ed, Search all you want, I never stated Palin was my pick for 2012. Is she a possibility? Sure.
Loudoun Lady
on December 2nd, 2009Your pick for VP, 2008. Your comment was about past picks.
edmundburkenator
on December 2nd, 2009Ed, You are talking about 2 different elections. This thread’s discussion is about 2012, I have not made “a pick” for 2012, and my posts on here were responding to Dan on 2012. If you are assuming that because I supported Palin as the VP for 2008 and that carries into my support for her for 2012 – you are wrong.
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Are you supporting Biden 2012? That is the logic.
Loudoun Lady
on December 2nd, 2009” Are you supporting Biden 2012? That is the logic.”
If he does he will be dumber than owl shit. The Hopey Changey Express is off the tracks and plummeting down the hill at a high rate of speed. Biden’s proximity to the wreckage render him a political casualty.
G. Stone
on December 2nd, 2009Can you use supporting Biden in 2012 and logic in the same sentence ?
G. Stone
on December 2nd, 2009Slap me silly and call me Charlie….I am confused. Loudoun Lady, are you saying that you don’t support Ms. Palin for the 2012 Republican Presidential Nomination, or are you saying that to support Ms. Palin for the 2012 Republican Presidential Nomination is wrong? I agree with you that no one should assume anything about another and feel there is an adage about this – in my home country we had a saying that when translated roughly comes out as ‘Never follow the donkey, for he is but an ass’.
Ravi Oli
on December 2nd, 2009Ravi, I am not saying anything about anyone’s support of Palin. If people want to support her for 2012 – have at it. I think it’s a bit silly to be throwing support behind any candidate so early, but she certainly has a large following. I’d take her over Hopey Changey right now, but then again I’d take my hairdresser over the current occupant – at least he has run a business and understands basic economics. Plus he does a fantastic color job and makes his clients look fabulous, what more could you ask for?
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I think your home country is really NYC, am I correct?
Loudoun Lady
on December 2nd, 2009Stone, your read of current events is more analogous to owl shit.
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Your a victim of Obama Derangement Syndrome from day one. He’s a Marxist, Communist, Kenyan, Socialist, and a Muslim to boot, right?
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Your a hyper partisan, just like your sidekick LL (really, you guys must share the same keyboard or something). You likely haven’t read something that isn’t on the Weekly Standard’s reading list since college (the Rams are good this year by the way).
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“Yeah, Edmund, we have had so much success with your candidates. No thanks.” Please note the “have had”. This is a past tense LL. This, to most English speakers, means you are referring to the PAST, not the FUTURE. Thanks in advance for your apology.
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LL, the fact you would take Palin over Obama has put you into the “bat shit insane” category. You can dig your way out over the next several months I’m sure. Keep posting on the Hatrick thread, I agree with you there.
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Owl shit, bat shit… political discourse here does tend to have a certain scatological bent to it.
edmundburkenator
on December 3rd, 2009As I have stated before – when Edmund attacks you are on the right track.
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I will not apologize for your stupid assumption that I am backing Palin in 2012, if we are all still here in 2012 after the nit-wit in chief is finished ruining this country inside and out.
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Have fun defending Obama, it’s about to get very interesting.
Loudoun Lady
on December 3rd, 2009Edmund, Besides Palin and my hairdresser, I am adding several other folks to the list to I trust to do a better job than the current nit-wit in chief:
1. The lady the works at our local McDonald’s that holds 2 jobs (to make ends meet) and is originally from Iran. She know more about the middle east than Obama’s whole cabinet.
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2. The retired vet the works at my local Giant part-time. In my short discussions with him I have come to the conclusion that he has twice the intellect as the nit-wit and a real set of balls.
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3. My neighbor that has been a tile salesman for a small business for the past 20 years, helping it grow and prosper in good times and bad. He has a good head on his shoulders and always offers you a beer when you walk in his house.
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4. The trash man – I like him because he sings on the job.
Loudoun Lady
on December 3rd, 2009Loudoun Lady – I must get the name of this hairdresser of yours! I have no reason to doubt that he makes his clients look fantastic, which means that you look fantastic, too! From the way you write, you are what we refer to in my home country as a “frisky philly.” My home country is not, how you say “NYC”. My mother is from India and my father is from Italy – my name shows that they have a sense of humor. But I can tell that you have a sense of humor Loudoun Lady. You poke fun at yourself which is good. You eat at McDonalds, and you know that the vet at your Giant has a real set of balls, which is also good, and you like to drink beer with neighbors and listen to the trash man sing. I like you Loudoun Lady. Many blessings to you!
Ravi Oli
on December 3rd, 2009Ravi, My trash man just waved at me and sang “hey lady, hey lady, have good day” – what a trip! He has more optimism than most of the current administration.
Loudoun Lady
on December 3rd, 2009LL, I have not asserted who you will back in 2012, only who you backed in 2008.
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I will type slower for you.
Edmundburkenator
on December 3rd, 2009Edmund, Type slower and read it over before you send it, you aren’t as witty as you think you are. Mountain out of a molehill comes to mind as well.
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I read something funny yesterday that applies to you and several others on TC. Palin Derangement Syndrome is now being described as S1P1 – do you suffer?
Loudoun Lady
on December 4th, 2009Loudoun Lady – based on what you describe, it is true that the trash man giveth, and the trash man taketh away.
Ravi Oli
on December 4th, 2009To think this woman was chosen to hold the second highest office for our nation is truly sobering.
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I was just trying to correct your honest mistake up-thread LL.
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Your opinions on both candidates and wit are troubling. You and Ravi can entertain each other…
Edmundburkenator
on December 4th, 2009No, what you were trying to do is be a jack-ass Edmund. You do it very well.
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My opinion on the nit wit are troubling? Good, because he is. Start standing up for YOUR choice as President and stop nit-picking on me. It would be refreshing to hear what you stand for, not who you stand against.
Loudoun Lady
on December 4th, 2009Your memory is bad too it seems. I doubt if you really want a refresher. You just want the last word.
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Have at it.
Edmundburkenator
on December 4th, 2009Talk about last work-itis.
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I don’t want to go round and round on your warped ideology, it would just be really nice to hear you advocate for the nit-wit. Stick up for your guy. The Savior, THE ONE you threw up as the best hope for this country. You are against an awful lot, esp conservative women. Now tell us what is so fantstinkintastic about the nit wit. Please.
Loudoun Lady
on December 4th, 2009